Ep 201 Dawn Jackson | Uncovering My Inner Light Through Divorce Death and Career Change


SHOW NOTES SUMMARY:

Uncover the Power of Healing and Transformation

In the latest episode of Grieving Voices, I had the pleasure to chat with Dawn Michele Jackson, a multifaceted professional and best-selling author who is passionate about guiding people from pain to joy after loss.

Dawn opened up about her personal journey through grief following a tough divorce at 30. She shared how she discovered the grief recovery method that revolutionized her life, allowing her to view past events not as setbacks but as stepping stones towards self-discovery and growth.

She delved into how unresolved grief can create barriers in all relationships and discussed how these tools helped her become more present for herself and her children. Dawn also recounted leaving nursing during the pandemic to focus on emotional healing, which led to writing books and facilitating retreats aimed at helping others heal their hearts.

For those feeling stuck in their grieving process or curious about transformative personal development opportunities – this episode is a must-listen!

Tune in now for an inspiring story of resilience, hope, and finding joy amidst life’s challenges. Don’t forget – your heart holds the key to unlocking a fulfilling life beyond grief!

Episode Transcription:

Victoria Volk: Welcome. Welcome to another episode of grieving voices. Thank you for tuning in. Today, my guest is Dawn Michele Jackson. She is an advanced grief recovery method specialist, an infinite possibilities trainer, women’s retreat facilitator, nurse, and an Amazon best selling author. And her primary focus is to guide individuals through healing their hearts transforming their lives and rediscovering joy. She is driven by her profound mission and is dedicated to helping individuals uncover their inner light and shift from surviving to thriving. With her nurturing approach, she skillfully supports her clients in healing their hearts and achieving mind, body, and spirit wellness. Thank you so much for being my guests today, and It’s nice to have a fellow advanced brief recovery method specialist on my podcast. It’s been a while.

Dawn Jackson: Thank you, Victoria. I’m happy to be here this morning.

Victoria Volk: Both of us have the same mission, helping people heal their hearts, that we know it’s possible regardless of what you’ve been through. And today, you’re here to share your personal story of going through a divorce. But there’s always more than that. Right? Because grief is cumulative and cumulatively negative as you and I both know.
But let’s start there. What brought you to grief recovery?

Dawn Jackson: So what brought me to grief recovery is I had done after my divorce at the age of thirty. My world kind of fell apart. You know, I had that white picket fence dream, and it was shattered. And I had a three and a half year old son. I didn’t really know how to move forward. So I realized that I could choose two things. I could continue to be angry about my husband decided he wanted a divorce or I could choose to heal and move forward. So I had done all kinds of workshops and retreats, you know, to try and heal the things that were hurting me. And not all of them provided a little bit of relief. None of them helped me feel completely better to the point of moving forward in a direction that I felt like I was thriving. And then I came across the grief recovery method. My mom had done the program and become a specialist and she referred me and my significant other to the method and he actually signed me up And at the time he did, I said to him. And I always laugh about this. I don’t have any grief. Because in my mind, grief was about death. Right? And I had lost a grandparent, but I didn’t have anybody else really close that had died. So that’s kind of the joke because I quickly learned within the first hour of the training that I was suffering a great deal of grief from things that it happened for my entire life. So my divorce is one of the first relationship I decided to work on and heal because I knew that to be, you know, an effective parent, I needed to you know, let go of some of the pain that was keeping me stuck.

Victoria Volk: And did you say your significant your husband at the time signed you up?

Dawn Jackson: No. My said no. So my husband I were divorced, but my son Oh, okay. Okay. Yeah.

Victoria Volk: Okay. And how has that relationship changed and shifted since you’ve gone through this method because you share a child, right? You still have to have some communication, I imagine, and

Dawn Jackson: So our son is now an adult and he’s twenty six years old. So I guess what changed for me is that I began to see our divorce is really a gift in my life because when we got divorced, I didn’t know who I was. I was a mom, I was a nurse, and I was a wife, but I had put so much focus on all of those that I didn’t really even know what I like to do, you know, for, you know, extracurricular activities. So for me, It helped me find myself again. My husband leaving was my catalyst for healing finding my authentic self, being able to create the life that I wanted. And at some point, I was able to go back to him and just be instead of angry, I found this peace inside and actually so much gratitude for him, for our marriage, for our child having a child together and for the divorce. And so I think that it’s allowed us to have a healthy relationship and I see that he also has a lot of gratitude for me. So I think that me changing, me healing, you know, has made it comfortable circle so that we can have a good relationship. And while we rarely talk to each other since our child is now an adult, during those years when he was growing up, it really helped us navigate our relationship smoother.

Victoria Volk: For those listening that this might be the first episode they stumble upon and maybe you’re hearing about grief recovery for the first time because I try and talk about it a lot through my episodes, but can you just share a little bit about what grief recovery is in your perspective? And, yeah, Yeah.

Dawn Jackson: So a great recovery is it’s an evidence based tool to help people move from a place of pain and just barely surviving to actually some recovery, which means being able to while you still have the memories associated with some type of loss in your life, you can move forward with the good memories versus having the pain in your heart that you continue to carry forward in everything you do because all the pain leaves us at a disadvantage in all of our relationships because we bring it forward. It’s kind of like if we can all think about our first love way back when probably we were a teenager. And our heart was completely open with that person. And then we got because most of us are not with our first love. So you get hurt. And then the next relationship you go into, your heart is a little less open. So that a closed heart creates problems in the relationship because we don’t show up in the same way. And then we have another person who’s had past relationships and their hearts a little bit close too. So by going through the act and the tools of the grief recovery method, we’re able to let go of some of that stuff that we’re holding on to that keeps us from being able to have the types of relationships and really the life that we dream about.

Victoria Volk: I say too, like for me personally going through grief recovery myself, it really made me a much more present and emotionally evolved parent I would say, like, I a better version of myself as a parent, I think, came as a result of going through grief recovery, would you agree that that was your experience too?

Dawn Jackson: Oh, I would totally agree. Because there was so much stuff that was kind of keeping me stuck, holding me back from being the best version of myself. That once I was able to do so much healing, I was able to show up in different ways for my child that I hadn’t been able to in the past. I mean, I remember right after my divorce for, like, months. I had a hard time just getting through each day. It was like, I knew I had to get up. I knew I had to take care of my child. But I was always looking forward to when do I get to go to sleep. I know I had nothing to do with my child. I just was so stuck in the grief of I failed marriage and feeling like I was a failure that I didn’t know how to navigate you know, being a single parent and I thought that he wasn’t in the picture. He was always in the picture. But just, you know, day to day not having him in the house anymore. And just navigating, you know, everything with my child without another person, you know, around was very difficult for me. So it took quite some time for me to figure out how to take steps in my life. To move forward and how to find that happiness again.

Victoria Volk: When you’re first going through the divorce in your relationship with your spouse at the time? Did you have a lot of your own friendships outside of the marriage? Like, girlfriends and things? Or was it where most of your friends, like, shared friends with him? And I what I hear a lot from women who have experienced divorce that come on my podcast, it’s, you know, it’s like you have your your together friends. And then when that relationship falls, you know, comes apart and you divorce, you lose a lot of people. In your list because of it? And was that your experience as well?

Dawn Jackson: So our closest friends were a couple that we hung out with all the time. So that was very, very difficult. And in fact, she was the one that I talked to almost every night, you know, crying wishing that something would change, wishing that he would change his mind, that we could stay together. And I know that was very difficult for her as well because we couldn’t do all those couple things together. So it was a loss for all four of us. Right? And then later they ended up divorced as well. So, you know, it was heartbreaking really because we were also close. We’d go on trips together and spend weekends together or kids were the same age, so they grew up together. So yes, I can relate to that. Luckily, since I was a nurse, I had lots of friends at work, and they really picked me up. And I remember they said, okay, well, we’re gonna go hiking this weekend, and I said, oh, I can’t do that. How long how far are you gonna go? Oh, five miles? Oh, I can’t do that. And the joke is we decided to go on the hike. I agreed And, like, I was way ahead of them on the trail, and so they remind me of that to this day, but it was really those friends that were able to help me get through the time because they could see how sad I was and, you know, that I just didn’t know what to do with my life, having lost. One of the most important people in my life.

Victoria Volk: You’d mentioned that your mom had gone through the method herself did she become certified as well?

Dawn Jackson: She did. Mainly, she did it for herself. She didn’t end up, you know, working with clients or anything, but she definitely gained a lot from the experience. So she was the one, the proponent of, you know, me going and checking out the program, seeing how it would help me because it had created such a change in her life.

Victoria Volk: And what drew her to to the method?

Dawn Jackson: I think, you know, just stuff from her past, from her childhood, that she and I don’t remember how she found it, but she just wanted to feel different. She just wanted to feel better. And you know, she I always grew up with dogs, two golden retrievers, and she’d lost so many of them, you know, by the time I became an adult. And that was just heartbreaking for her. So I think that was another reason that attracted her to the grief recovery method because she just wanted to find some peace and ability to move forward because it weighed so heavily on her heart.

Victoria Volk: Had she also been with your father when he had passed? Like, were they still together? No.

Dawn Jackson: They were no longer together. So they got divorced about the same age as my husband I got divorced. Like, my son was about three and a half, and I was about three and a half when my parents divorced as well.

Victoria Volk: Okay. So not only are you going through your own divorce, but it’s compounded by the divorce of your parents.

Dawn Jackson: Correct.

Victoria Volk: Yes. And you’re an adult at this point. And that can be You know what I mean? Like, it’s one thing to once you’re an adult in your parents divorce, I think there’s a whole different it’s so many different layers to that. Can you speak to that a little bit? How that maybe influenced how you felt about your divorce or what that was like, experiencing that from the perspective of a child? Mhmm. And as the person going through it.

Dawn Jackson: So I think, you know, probably a lot of people think this way, you know, when their parents divorce, when their young children, they think about their future and their partner, and they never want to go through a divorce. Right? Because they’ve experienced it and it doesn’t feel good. And while it worked out best for my mom and my dad, there was just part of me that always had wished they had stayed together, you know, that it had worked out in some way. So for me, you know, I had wanted so badly for my marriage to stay intact and then it didn’t. So that was pretty heartbreaking. I yeah. I definitely think that that added to my grief.

Victoria Volk: And maybe how you looked at your son. Right? And because you’re grieving I mean, am am I wrong to say that you were a grieving child, an adult child?

Dawn Jackson: Correct. Yeah. No. I would definitely say that I was. There were so many things, you know, about my childhood. I mean, you know, my mother was wonderful. She was always there for me. But there was just things about it like my parents divorce and, you know, both of them remarried and those things while they did provide a lot of happiness. There was also sadness because it wasn’t the intact family that I had hoped for. And then when I couldn’t give that to my son.
You know, I felt like failure.

Victoria Volk: Since you went through grief recovery and you’ve been working with clients, what are some of the things in going through the divorce that you share from your experience with the people that you work with.

Dawn Jackson: You know, I always share with people really how I felt right when it happened because what I notice is so many people don’t talk about it. You know, how devastated they are and how much their life feels like it’s been turned upside down and those days of not wanting to get out of bed and, you know, just wishing the hours away. I always share that with people because it’s I usually get a response, oh my gosh, like, I’ve felt that way before. Like, I just didn’t know how to know how to move on. Because unfortunately in society, you know, we’re just expected to keep moving forward. Keep busy, you know, one of the myths. And it’s kinda like when we go through a death. Right? We get usually the one or two days off of work and that’s it and we’re expected to come back and just be normal again. Well, it’s really no difference with divorce. I mean, divorce is a death too. Right? But a couple days, we don’t just feel better. You know, it’s just a reminder every single day when we wake up and we’re alone. That our marriage didn’t work out. And so I always share my personal stories about, you know, the way that I felt after my divorce and, you know, navigating being a mom as well, a single mom and the difficulties behind that.

Victoria Volk: Before we started to record you had shared about your father passing. And at that point, you had already been a certified grief specialist, advanced specialist. Is that correct?

Dawn Jackson: Yeah. Yeah.

Victoria Volk: So how having the tools now in your toolbox versus not having them before until you did. How was that experience? Did you find that that was your ability to cope and move through that? Grief different now that you had the tools?

Dawn Jackson: You know, when I went through my divorce, I really didn’t have any tools. I mean, I had some. Right? But I hadn’t really started my healing journey. So all I knew was I was angry, I was sad, I didn’t know how to move forward. I thought I would never feel better. And you know, when I lost my dad, while I still had some of the same emotions, I knew that I had some tools that when I chose to use them would help me move forward and feel better. So there was hope. Right? Because I knew that I wasn’t stuck forever. And, you know, like, I always remind my clients because we do the work when we’re ready. Right? It’s not like something happens in the next day, we do the healing work. It usually takes a little bit of time before we’re ready. And I always remind people that when it’s the right time, you know, you will do the work, but just make sure that you’re still willing to do it. Right? Because you know you have these tools. So you need to step into them when you’re ready. So like I said, it gave me hope. You know, after I lost my dad because that was pretty devastating to me as well. But I knew that I had a way out of the pain. So I was grateful that I had learned the grief recovery method before he died.

Victoria Volk: I think it’s one thing to have someone in our life who we look up to and value their opinions, such as our mother who suggests something that you know, and we and when we witness it changing their life. Right? It’s I think it’s easier to buy in to Right. Something. Right? So it was easier for you to buy into the grief recovery method because you had seen how it helped your mother and changed her life. Mhmm. So for those listening who have or hearing about Great Recovery for the first time who, you know, when we say, yes, you need to be ready to do the work. It also takes courage. You might not be ready. You know, you might not be ready, but you don’t get ready by not putting your shoes on. And taking action to do the work. Yes. You get ready by getting ready. You know?

Dawn Jackson: Right. No. Yeah. You totally have to have the courage. You have to make the decision to step through the fear. I mean, like, I have a great example that’s going on in my life today. So When I left my nursing job two years ago, I decided one of the things I wanted to do was try backpacking because my son has been going backpacking since he was a teenager. And so I decided to go on a backpacking trip with them. So fast forward, I haven’t gone on one since twenty twenty two. And so he called me up last week and said, hey, you wanna go on five day backpacking trip with me. And so, you know, he sends me some information about it, and I’m looking, oh my goodness, the elevation and, you know, the miles we’re gonna do and everything. So I’m super excited. And then, you know, the last couple days, I’m, like, have this fear. Like, oh, boy, can I do this? Like, I’m two years older, and it’s a lot of miles and how’s my back gonna feel? And, you know, so it’s a reminder of those things like, we have to choose to step through that fear. We have to choose to have that courage even though we don’t know how it’s gonna turn out. And I always, you know, ask my clients to have the courage because it is scary to try something new. You know, even if it is something that we think might work to help us heal the pain that we’re experiencing. And I noticed like after a few sessions. It’s probably halfway through. All of a sudden, I see on people’s faces when I’m working with them online. They just look more peaceful. It’s amazing. It happens every single time because they’re

Victoria Volk: so great.

Dawn Jackson: They’re so scared because they don’t know what it’s going to involve. They don’t know what’s going to come up. And the work is not easy and I always tell people that but I wouldn’t ask you to do something I never did. So I love that reminder that we have to continue even when we have fear to step through that and move forward. Take the steps that we need to take, have the courage so that we can feel better.

Victoria Volk: I often have to remind myself like I don’t grow in my comfort zone.

Dawn Jackson: That is so true.

Victoria Volk: Step out of my comfort zone. You know, speaking in front of people, so much fear. Right? Like, there’s so much fear speaking in front of people. Like, am I gonna forget what I’m gonna say? I’m gonna stumble over my words. Am I gonna embarrass myself? Like, all these things. Right? But you just you don’t grow, you don’t get better, you don’t it’s not practice make makes perfect. It’s practice helps you grow. And It does. And you have to practice that courage. Mhmm.

Dawn Jackson: Sorry to get a trip. I am. Yeah. We’re leaving happy to be nice.

Victoria Volk: Yeah. Because here’s the thing. You know, we we raise our kids for eighteen years. Right? We hope that we’ve done our job and they leave at eighteen and they start to go on their own adventures and finding themselves and all of this and that and To be asked, I just wanna say this, to be asked by your twenty six year old son. I have a nineteen year old son. But to be asked by your twenty six year old son, mom, Do you want to take this backpacking trip with me for five days? He’s asking you, do you want to spend time with me for five days? Mhmm. This I wanna spend time with you for five days. That’s what I hear. And I just wanna cry for joy with you. I just wanna cry with joy for you because I would do it just because of that.

Dawn Jackson: Oh, and even if I

Victoria Volk: had zero trading, like, just sign me up. If my son asked me, I would be, like, heck, yes. You might have to pick me up a few times, but heck, yes.

Dawn Jackson: Right. And that’s why I do it because for me, like, we since he was a little boy, I was hiking with him. You know, I used to live in about an hour from the Columbia Gorge in Oregon, so we had beautiful waterfalls and hiking trails and I took him hiking all the time. I have tons of pictures, you know. He would be like, how how much farther? And I so I’d have to have all these tree bags. To keep him occupied and he talked the whole time. It was so funny. And so then he grew up and has a love for the wilderness and it he likes to be out as far as he possibly can where there’s nobody. Right? And it’s a connection that we have. So when I get asked to do something like that, you’re exactly right. I’m doing it because I wanna spend time with him. Yeah. It’s such a great opportunity

Victoria Volk: because we aren’t promised tomorrow.

Dawn Jackson: No. We aren’t.

Victoria Volk: And I

Dawn Jackson: mean, the last few years, you know, COVID and everything. I think most of us realize that. And that’s another reason why I left my job that I really wasn’t happy at because I wanted to help people in a different way. And I wanted to have the time with the people I love to be able to, you know, do the things I wanted to do and, you know, not wait until retirement because I have lost multiple friends. They retired. And then within a few months, they were no longer with us. And so I just decided it’s time to live life now, not in ten years from now.

Victoria Volk: It’s a great segue. So let’s talk more about that because you were a nurse for thirty years. Right? Thirty years. Yes. What was the catalyst for that decision. Like, what made you just hit the word go?

Dawn Jackson: To the

Victoria Volk: safe health. Yeah.

Dawn Jackson: To the safe nursing? Yeah. So I used to live in Portland, Oregon, and that’s where most of my nursing was. And the last few years of living there, I just I felt miserable. I mean, I made really good money so I could do most of the things I wanted to do. But there was something missing. Like, once I began my healing journey after my divorce, I realized that there was so much like healing that most people needed that wasn’t physical. And what I saw was that the emotional pain was causing physical pain. In my patients. And there’s a lack of mental health resources really available to people. It’s like, well, we can send you to a therapist, but not everybody wants a therapist. A lot of people want other modalities and insurance doesn’t pay for it. And so I became more and more frustrated because I just didn’t feel like I was making a difference I wanted to make. So I thought it was the actual job. So when I moved a few hours away, I had a different nursing job. And what I noticed was I didn’t feel any better because I was still doing the same thing. I was still telling people we’re gonna put you on a new medication. And I wasn’t helping them address all the emotional stuff, right, that they’d experienced during their whole life. And it’s time I was working with veterans. So veterans are really, you know, specific population, and they’ve gone through so many things that anybody who’s not a veteran really doesn’t understand. There’s a lot of pain. Yeah. There’s a lot of emotions there’s a lot of experiences that they don’t share with anybody except for their fellow veterans and sometimes they don’t even do that. So COVID hit And we were short staffed even more. People were quitting left and right. And we were asked to do more with less. And I was noticing that I kept getting sick I just emotionally wasn’t in a good place. I was never sleeping. And my intuition, because I use it quite a bit, was telling me if you don’t leave, then you’re gonna get sick, like, really sick. And that’s gonna be the end of, you know, being able to do the job that you’re doing. And so I just sat with it and sat with it and, you know, the universe kept giving me these, like, signs. Like, you need to do this, you need to leave. You need to do something different. You need to follow your passion. And so finally, I just had it. And it was really hard to get to that spot, especially because I was raised that you have the good job, you have the good benefits, you know, and you’re super responsible. And so for me to leave, what I was doing, it felt super scary. But it just got to the point where it was too hard to not leave. And so the day I turned in my resignation, I can’t even tell you how different I felt. Like my life felt completely changed. I felt a weight lift off of my shoulders. I felt probably physically better than I had in a long time. You know, and of course, they said to me, well, how about we let you go part time? And I said, you know, I’ve asked for the last year and a half to go part time. And you’ve denied it. So no. Well, can you stay for a few more weeks? And I said, no. And I said, well, why not? I said because I’m going back back in with my son, well, can’t you put that off? And I said, no. So for me, it was like too little, too late. Like, it was time for me to take care of me. I’ve spent my life taking care of other people. You know, nurses, moms, women were caregivers. And so for me to choose me was difficult and yet it was the best choice I’ve ever made in my life.

Victoria Volk: What did you go to after you signed put in your resignation?

Dawn Jackson: So then I spent three months not doing anything except for taking care of me, and I would sleep till like ten or eleven, which I can’t do that now. I always wake up at, like, seven thirty just my body does, but I was so tired. That’s how exhausted I was. Emotionally, depleted, physically depleted. I felt like my soul had just dried up. So that’s what I did for the first three months. I went back back in with my son. To cure me. And then at the end of the year, I started figuring out what I was gonna do. So I decided to get my advanced brief recovery method certification. So that I could do the work online. And then I started planning some retreats, so I do women’s retreats as well. And I finished writing my first book. So it’s yeah. It’s my life has just turned around in so many ways. I’m I feel so full of joy now every single day. Versus it used to be just drudgery going to work because I didn’t feel like I was making the difference that I wanted to make.

Victoria Volk: I love that for you. And I what I wanna share with listeners is that, on par with what you said, my life changed when and I it sounds like for you too, like, grief recovery was the catalyst for you coming into yourself for you to become empowered in your decisions and your path forward, I feel the same way, like, everything that I’ve accomplished, like, you know, certifications and different trainings and working with grievers and energy healing work. Like, all of it was after I went through grief recovery Mhmm. Than the past going on six years. So it’s a catalyst for change. It’s not just to feel better for a short period of time, like we often resort to alcohol or drugs or relationships or shopping or gambling, you know, these herbs that you and I know about short term energy relieving behaviors. Speaking of which, What were your nerves while you were going through? What sounds like to me was burnout in your nursing career? How were you coping with that?

Dawn Jackson: I would say, well, during COVID, I mean, I think a lot of people can relate to this, like, you know, we thought the world was ending in an we didn’t know what to expect. So, you know, it was, oh, have that glass of wine every night. You know, and after a while, I was like, okay, this isn’t good. You know, I because I don’t typically drink like that, but that was one of them. And you know, it was coming on from work and having that glass of wine, keeping busy, I would say, you know, social media, like scrolling the news feed, Those were my big ones. I’m trying to think back. Yeah. Those were I would say my two big ones. I was, you know, I was so tired from work that I felt like I didn’t have time to do any of the things that I really wanted to do as just exhausted. So, like, you know, where I had moved a few years ago to some place that’s beautiful. It’s like in the mountains. We have so many trees and rivers and lakes. I’d love to hike. I wasn’t doing any of that. I wasn’t exercising. So probably food a little bit too. Because when I quit my job, I weighed, like, probably ten pounds more than I’ve ever weighed, and I’m a pretty short person. So you know, for me to gain that much weight, typically, I don’t really gain weight easily so that I knew that yeah, I wasn’t in a good space emotionally.

Victoria Volk: And it sounds like I think a lot of people go through this especially after you’ve been doing something for so many years, you know, it’s like a depression. Right? It’s you’re you’re depressed.

Dawn Jackson: Yeah. One of the things that I’ll share this, the grief recovery method helped me with was, you know, although I left my job And I was happy about that. There was a really painful few weeks months because all those coworkers have become my friends. You know, they were my tribe. They got me through COVID and all the difficulties that came along with that. I mean, every time we walked into work, there was oh, we have to change this protocol, we have to change that, and so to leave all those people and knowing I was leaving them, even shorter staffed was really difficult for me, but the grief recovery method helped me with being able to make sure that I was complete in all those relationships. So Like, I went around and talked to all the people I was close to before I even put my notice in. And I told them why I was leaving. I told them what they meant to me. How important our relationship had been. How grateful I was for them. And you know not one person said to me, I can’t believe you’re quitting. Everybody said, I’m so glad that you’re taking care of yourself. Because I told them why I was doing it. It wasn’t that I just really dislike this job. It was that I needed to take care of me. That was most important to me at this time, that time. And so it helped me leave that job and not feel like there were all these loose ends because I was able to communicate with all the people that were important to me.

Victoria Volk: What I also hear is that your why for quitting was much stronger than your fear.

Dawn Jackson: Yes. It was. Because I knew that I was getting the point I didn’t have a choice because the universe kept giving me these signs. And the fact that I kept getting sick and I couldn’t sleep and, you know, I just did not feel like I was surviving were big enough for me. It was what I noticed now too is, you know, I used to just get these really nice paychecks And while they meant something to me, not like my pay today, you know, when I’m working with a client, you know, a hundred dollars means more than thousand dollars she used to because I feel like I’m really making a difference. I noticed the transformation in people’s lives.

Victoria Volk: So what do you say to people who just doubtful that grief recovery can help them?

Dawn Jackson: So, you know, we always talk about what they’ve tried and, you know, I always tell them my stories. About how it’s helped me move forward. I’ve talked to them about their reservations. You know, oftentimes it’s money. But I also thank a lot of it’s fear. Like, they don’t know that this is gonna work. And so, you know, I always remind them that they deserve to live a better life than what they’re experiencing at the time. And that unless they, you know, take a step to move forward and to heal their heart, they’re gonna stay stuck in that same place. But I’m also very aware of, like we talked about earlier, that someone also needs to be ready. They need to choose to step into something. And so, you know, I give them a lot of space. You know, and I have people tell me, oh, I’ve been following you for like a year. And I’ve been reading your stuff and I keep clicking on your calendar link for a discovery call. And then they finally get to the point. They finally have that courage to do it because I want them to have that courage versus feeling like they’re being pushed into something. Because I as you know, we want them to show up fully. Because that’s the only way they’re gonna really heal.

Victoria Volk: Yeah. You can’t you can’t half ass this.

Dawn Jackson: No. You cannot.

Victoria Volk: You can’t. You can’t.

Dawn Jackson: No. It doesn’t work.

Victoria Volk: Yeah. Because, you know, as you know, it’s like you get into, like, weeks four to five, you know, it you know, they even tell us, like, you know, especially if you do in person work or groups or whatever, hey, you know, you warn them, like, you’re gonna wanna not put your shoes on and walk out that door. But, you know, that’s the time you need to. Dig within yourself and Mhmm. Find that courage to push through.

Dawn Jackson: Yeah. It’s hard. I mean, In some ways, I’m grateful I did it in the certification training, right, versus, like, seven weeks. Same? Because I wasn’t going to be leaving the certification training because that’s dummy. If I start something, I’m going to finish it. Right? So it, like, forced me to continue going through the process, which was really painful at the time, but you know, I wish I could I wish that there was some way to relay to people, like, yes, going through the process can be difficult, but when you get to the other end, the feeling is amazing. Like, not always right away, but you start noticing how your life is changing, how you feel differently. And there’s such a freedom to that.

Victoria Volk: I would like us to share our own personal experiences of going through this method, which is possible in the two day workshop, which Yes. Neither of us are trained to do. Correct? Correct. Yep. So we went through the certification, and that’s a four day process. So, basically, we’re kinda going through the two day workshop that’s available only from certain trainers through Discovery Institute. But can you please share your personal experience of going through the training and the program itself?

Dawn Jackson: So like I said, when I first ended up at the training, I didn’t think I had any grief. And within about an hour, I realized that there were a lot of things in my life that were grieving events. So first, it was difficult to look at that. I mean, it wasn’t that I never thought about those things I did, but when you think about them all together, one day, you know, it’s like, wow, I’ve been through a lot. And I think most people realize that. We’re not born and then we don’t have any of these grieving experiences. We all have them. There’s, you know, people always think about death. There’s deaths. There’s the time that you went to school when, you know, maybe your best friend was mean to you. They bullied you. You know, even those little things, those stick with us because they create some of our belief systems we have about ourselves, you know, even happy things like having a child that can be a grievance experience as well because it completely changes our life. Like, you know, you’re happy. You’re having a child, but then you go home and you’re like, oh my gosh. I can’t even go to the store, right, by myself. So all those things, you know, came up for me you know, the experiences in my life, the relationships that I had that were less than what I’d hoped for, and all the hopes dreams and expectations that I’d had that didn’t happen in my life. So it was overwhelming at first, but I think as the days went by, I just realized I am in the right place to heel, and this is such a supportive environment. And I’m gonna come out on the other side. Like, I started to realize Like, this is going to change my life. This is amazing work. So that was kind of my experience. And then, you know, for a while after I became certified it didn’t really do anything with it except I did do my own work. I mean, I think, to this day, I’ve done, like, twenty different relationships in my life. And I notice every time I do one, like, how significantly my life changes and I notice it in my relationships too because we all know relationships aren’t easy. Any type of relationship, they can be a struggle at times. But doing this work keeps me in a space where I can continue to learn and to grow and work together with someone versus wanting to just walk away.

Victoria Volk: I physically got sick. At my at my training. Like so I went down I flew down to Texas for mine. Okay. So it’s like, I think of it as the version of me that was on that plane going down there was not the same me that came back. And like, I’ve it was, you know, thirty plus years of grief that I had none you know, had stuff down and pushed down and so much anger and resentment and all this stuff was coming up. But I physically, like, both ends And and I came to that class. I was bound and determined and good for me that I had actually read the book before even going. Because yeah. I not because I’d actually tried to DIY this before I went to that certification, like,

Dawn Jackson: yeah.

Victoria Volk: I can learn this. I don’t need somebody to walk me through this. I don’t yeah. I’m gonna I’m gonna help people. Like, that’s why I’m doing this. I wanna help other people. Like, I don’t need this. Other people need this. And so I was reading the book and then I’m like, oh, yeah, I think I need this. And had another loss, actually, that came about at the same time. And I was like, yeah, I definitely need this. Mhmm. And Yeah. I was so sick. I Susan was my trainer and she ended up going and getting me drama mean and I was laying on the floor listening to her instruction. And yeah. And it turned out to be training experience for her that she she’ll probably never ever have again just the dynamics of the group, which was Mhmm. Really crazy. But, yeah, it was a very is very life changing, just that experience for me. Sandy Derby was there too at the at the same time, and she

Dawn Jackson: was Right.

Victoria Volk: Yeah, she was my ended up being my partner and yeah. It it was an amazing experience for me, but tell you what, if stuff was per it was like the purge before the purge, you know. And so it can I mean, our bodies speak to us?

Dawn Jackson: They do. I hear that story a lot that people get sick. It was, yeah, we’re trying to get rid of this stuff, but there’s part of us that’s, like, Is it safe to get rid of it? No.

Victoria Volk: And a different mechanism for me? Yeah. Can I tell you what? I couldn’t just hop on the plane and go I could have gone back home. But like you said, had that, I think, been in a group setting or having, you know, had to go somewhere? I you know, I can see where people would have a hard time sticking it out, but that is where the courage needs to come in and Mhmm. And our responsibility too as the as the specialist and the facilitator to hold people’s hands and meet them where they’re at and continue to show them the improvement that is happening. Because I think it’s hard to see it when you’re in it too. Right? Like, oh, I’m a mess. I’m not progressing. Like, this isn’t helping, but that Right. That is the work. Exactly. I had a client even say to me. She’s like, you know, people always say, you gotta do the work. You gotta do the work. And after she went through this program with me, she was like, I understand now. Mhmm. What the work is. This program is the work. Mhmm. That’s what I just

Dawn Jackson: yeah. I love how the certification, like, you you can become certified unless you do your own work because you’re right. Like, so many people think, well, this is for somebody else. I mean, I get people to reach out to me all the time and say, oh, my sister really needs this. My mom really needs this.

Victoria Volk: Mhmm.

Dawn Jackson: And, you know, it’s really hard because everybody needs this. We’re all griefers. We talk about that all the time. Right? Because we’ve all had grieving events in our life. It’s like, we can’t even sit down and watch a movie or show at night without seeing all the grief. Because once you know something, you can’t unknow it. And I feel sad that there just aren’t more programs like this that can really help people move forward, not temporarily, but permanently. You know? And I love this tool because you can use it for anything that’s happened in the past and for anything that happens in the future.

Victoria Volk: I’ve applied this to my relationship with money alcohol, my inner child. Mhmm. You can apply it to your relationship with food. Like, I’ve applied this in a lot of different ways and aspects of my life, and it’s remarkable what comes up.

Dawn Jackson: Oh, yeah. It definitely is. I always know when there’s some work I need to do, when some just keeps coming up. It keeps coming up. It keeps coming up. It’s like the universe knocking at my door. Hello. When you’re gonna do the work, But we know we always have those tools, and that’s why I love giving people. It’s like, you know, I’m gonna work with you for, you know, seven weeks, but then you’re gonna have this tool for the rest of your life and you don’t have to come back to me unless you want to, which, you know, from one of my personal stories is I went to a therapist for years after my divorce. And while there were things that helped me with, I don’t feel like I ever got any type of the resolution that I’ve gotten with the grief recovery method. It was like I just kept going back and talking about the same thing over and over and over again. So I love that this program this tool, this method doesn’t keep people stuck, you know, continuing to talk about the same thing, like, we’re helping you. Get to the point where you don’t have to keep talking about all the negative things because we’re gonna help you feel better. These tools are gonna help you feel better.

Victoria Volk: And it’s like algebra. You know, every lesson builds upon it self, the building on the week before, and towards the end, I think it, you know, starts to click. I mean

Dawn Jackson: Alright. Great.

Victoria Volk: But Hey, algebra. But might not be the best analogy, but it’s yeah. That’s I think that’s how this is so brilliantly made is that it you’re always taking just a little bit more of a step forward for the process. I always ask that option. Yeah.

Dawn Jackson: I would agree.

Victoria Volk: And we’re empowering people. And I would ask I always ask people like, What has it been costing you to not feel empowered? Yes. What is that costing you?

Dawn Jackson: Yeah, there is so much to helping people feel empowered. Because when people don’t feel empowered, they stay small. They seem to call us. Yeah. Exactly.
And they don’t put themselves out there, the gifts that they came here to share with others. So, you know, I always think because I’m all about grief and joy and how those go together, for me is, like, If we can heal the grief, we get to the joy. That’s exactly what happened in my life. I wouldn’t really find that joy because I was so stuck in all the things that had happened that broke my heart. And once I was able to work through that using the grid recovery method, now I’m able to find the joy every day. I mean, every day might not be wonderful but I can always find something that’s wonderful in every day.

Victoria Volk: Well, and then you can recognize what it is that, you know, if you start going down this slope of, oh, I’m starting to, you know, be a workaholic or Mhmm. I’m starting to want to drink that glass of wine at the end of the day, like

Dawn Jackson: Right.

Victoria Volk: We’re able to recognize that within ourselves. And like you said, you can’t unknow it. So You see it in other people.

Dawn Jackson: Oh, yes.

Victoria Volk: You see how people are coping with life. And, yeah, it’s grief is all around us.

Dawn Jackson: Hold ends. Yeah. I’m I’m very grateful for the grief recovery lesson. What it allows us to do how it allows us to move forward in life,

Victoria Volk: and it allowed you to write your your book

Dawn Jackson: Yeah. No. I wrote two

Victoria Volk: notes here.

Dawn Jackson: Your book. Yeah. Which I don’t have that. So I’d wanted to write a book for years. I have a friend that’s a publisher. She helps people self publish books. And she coaches authors, writers. And I’d done a few things for her, some projects but I really wanted to do my own book. And so when I started thinking about leaving my nursing career, I started writing a book, and it’s called Journey to Peace and Healing. So I finished it after I left my job and then got it published, but it’s really about how to, you know, return to that state of peacefulness of joy of love So I talk about grief. There’s a whole chapter in there about grief. It’s really reflective journal, so I have each chapter is kind of structured. There’s writing, and then there’s reflective questions in journaling space. Because I really wanted it to be something that an individual picked up and didn’t just read like they looked at their own life. They chose to take steps. To move forward instead of staying stuck where they are. So I was pretty excited when that was published because that was one of my lifelong dreams as well.

Victoria Volk: When I self published mine in twenty seventeen, it’s So when you hold the book in your hands, there’s just no feeling like it is there.

Dawn Jackson: No. There isn’t. It’s pretty awesome. We we got.

Victoria Volk: So what does your grief taught you?

Dawn Jackson: I would say my grief has taught me my strength. You know, my ability to overcome to change my life, to be more authentic. Stop me that there’s more than just surviving and that I can thrive, that I can have the life that I truly desire to live

Victoria Volk: and that you can do hard things. Yes. Like a five day hike with your son. Right.

Dawn Jackson: Yeah. That’s true. And, you know, really that I wanna make the most of each moment. I think for years, I just lived day to day, you know, through the drudgery, I didn’t really look forward to much. I didn’t see how important it was to make the most of each day, and I feel differently now. You know, I try to make the time for the people I love even if it means I’m not working today. I try to tell people what they mean to me because like you said, life is short. So, yeah, it’s taught me a lot. I’m very grateful. I wouldn’t be who I am today without all that different events that I’ve been through that caused me grief.
But now I can see the gifts and the grief.

Victoria Volk: You know, I’ve been doing this podcast for I’ll be starting my fifth year here at the end of the month, and all the conversations that is the theme is that there’s gifts in it. And when you’re in it and you’re listening to you know, podcast episodes like this or people are sharing their stories and you might say, oh, well, I didn’t go through something that hard. Like, my grief isn’t that difficult or I didn’t experience it that I didn’t have it that bad or, you know, if we kind of place our grief on a chart, you know, against other people’s grief and there is no hierarchy because grief has felt that a hundred percent regardless of who you are and what you’ve been through and you can’t say that one thing is traumatic for this person and it’s not for another. It’s it’s so individual and that’s what I think I love about What I think people might see grief recovery as is like this cookie cutter approach. Right?
And it it’s not it’s couldn’t be more it couldn’t be further from the truth. It’s because grief is so individual, Yes. And this method honors the individuality of your grief. And that’s what I love about it. It yeah, it’s just it allows your individual grief to be expressed.

Dawn Jackson: Right. And it doesn’t compare. I always Yeah. Tell my clients, you know, even if you and I shared the same parent, like say we lost our mom, I don’t know how you feel and you don’t know how I feel because we had different relationships with her and we’re different individuals. We’re unique. Our thoughts, feelings, beliefs, are completely unique from one another. So I was trying to remind people that because, yeah, it really bothers me when people compare because they might have you know, had one loss, but they, you know, we’re talking to someone who they feel has had a more significant loss. But you’re right. Everybody experiences their grief at a hundred percent. So it’s really important to recognize that

Victoria Volk: And even too, like like you to your point growing up in the same home and having, you know, the the relationships are individual. And so it’s I’ve seen so many times in the work that I’ve done with clients, but even people who come on my podcast, it’s like, you know, there’s so much turmoil within the families because there’s this expectation of, well, I feel this way, you should feel this way, Right. That’s the same we have the same relate we have the same parent or we have the same father or whatever it was, but the lived experience is so different, you know. And that’s Yes. Because the relationship is different. You know, you can be closer to one parent than the other parent and the in fighting that can happen because we just don’t accept that all relationships are unique in individual. Mhmm. And that’s what this program helps each of us honor within our own lives. And that’s what I love about it.

Dawn Jackson: Oh, I would totally agree. I always when I’m working with my clients, you know, not only do I take them through the method, but I also try and provide some education as the program does about how we approach people who are grieving. You know, if we’re on the other end of that. And you know, everybody says, wow, I’ve said some of those unhelpful things. Like, I know how you feel. I’ve lost my father. And so I always remind people, be gentle with yourself. But one of the best things you can say to someone is, I can’t imagine how you feel. Because grievers often don’t feel heard. They often feel like we’re giving them advice or we’re comparing our losses or we’re judging And so I just think it’s such a great reminder that we never know how somebody else feels. And by saying that, it gives them an opening to express what’s going on in their heart without feeling shut down.

Victoria Volk: Is there anything else that you would like to share that you don’t feel like you got to?

Dawn Jackson: No, I feel like this has been a great conversation with you. I really appreciate spending this time together.

Victoria Volk: Likewise. And where can people find you if they would like to connect with you?

Dawn Jackson: So my website is don michelle jackson dot com. And then I’m also on Facebook, I’m on LinkedIn. But, yeah, domichel jackson dot com is my URL.

Victoria Volk: One l, by the way? Yes. One l.

Dawn Jackson: Thank you.

Victoria Volk: I figured that out. Really quick. Yeah. And I’ll put the link for that in the show notes. But when do you have another retreat coming up?

Dawn Jackson: It looks like October. I’m working on that right now. Securing a house to do it in in central Oregon. So they’re usually fairly small, like, up to ten people, ten women because, you know, we lodged together. We spent a few days together. It creates great connection and healing. I used to go to retreats myself, and I just they were so important for me in my process and to have that connection with other women and working on ourselves and empowering each other, so that’s why I offer these retreats to other women.

Victoria Volk: And do you bring other modalities into the retreats, or can you share a little how you like, what is offered during these trades?

Dawn Jackson: So we usually look at things like our belief systems. I always talk about grief. Although they don’t offer the method because that’s something that has to be done over, you know, several weeks. But I do talk about grief. And then, you know, we kind of look at where people are stuck, where they’re stuck now and where they want to be in their life and help them create a vision for the future. I usually bring in an another person to help me because it’s really fun to have two different perspectives on things. So I changed that up a little bit each time. So I haven’t quite planned it, but it’s gonna be announced hopefully in the next couple weeks.

Victoria Volk: And you can find all that information on your website as well. Correct?

Dawn Jackson: Correct.

Victoria Volk: Yep. And your book, also the link to your book is on your website.

Dawn Jackson: Both of my books are on my website, and they’re also on Amazon. The paper back and the digital version.

Victoria Volk: And on social, you are in social media as well. Yep. Well, thank you so much for sharing in your grief recovery experience with me and my listeners. I always love having other specialists on that you know, we can kind of talk shop a little bit, but also share personal experiences because I have seen this method not only work through the lives of my clients. But when I have people that come on my podcast who have also experienced it, it it’s like you just have to experience it. It’s kind of hard to describe and explain in a nutshell even. It’s I guess in in one word, it’d be transformative.

Dawn Jackson: I would agree.

Victoria Volk: You know, that would that would be the easiest way, I guess, to explain it, but it’s such a it’s such a big word too. Right? Like, can it really be transformative? Well, yes, it can. Yes.
When you do that

Dawn Jackson: work, Yeah. And the more work you do, the more transformative it is.

Victoria Volk: Exactly. It’s you know, I mean, when you continue to, like I said, you know, applied it to my relationship with money and alcohol and various aspects of my life. It’s it’s amazing what you can uncover and discover about yourself. So

Dawn Jackson: yeah. Well, thank you for having me and really enjoyed this time together, Victoria.

Victoria Volk: My pleasure, and thank you for being my guest. And remember, when you unleash your heart, you unleash your life, much love.

 

Ep 164 Amy Douglas | From Betrayal and Loss To Manifesting Joy

Amy Douglas | From Betrayal and Loss To Manifesting Joy

 

SHOW NOTES SUMMARY: 

How much betrayal and loss can the heart take within less than two years?

Today’s guest shares how betrayal, loss, unsurmountable grief, and a decline in health catalyzed her personal growth.

Amy chose to empower herself by getting a life coach and learning new tools that enabled her to recalibrate her life and move forward beyond the hurt, pain, and emotional hurricane she felt stuck in for too long.

In this episode, we dabble into Amy’s experience with Human Design, what she’s learned about herself, and how Human Design became the permission slip to radically change things, including leaving her corporate job.

We have all experienced something that challenges our beliefs and who we thought others were. We may question who we are and our role in the mess, and often, fear and expectations play a role and serve a purpose in making sense of our experiences.

Listen to today’s episode to hear Amy’s perspective on fear, how learning her Human Design helped her change her approach and point of view of expectations, and so much more!

RESOURCES:


CONNECT:

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If you are struggling with grief due to any of the 40+ losses, free resources are available HERE.

CONNECT WITH VICTORIA: 

Victoria Volk: Thank you for tuning in to grieving voices. I’m so excited for this episode because I’m talking with Amy Douglas. She is a human design reader. And I have been working with her as her client. But today’s episode is about her sharing her grief journey in what she’s learned through human design about herself and her grief. And I’m just really excited to bring this knowledge to the podcast because, like, one of my favorite quotes is the more you know yourself, the less you look to others to tell you who you are. And so human design is just another tool in the toolbox to help you to better understand yourself. And so Amy, thank you so much for being here and sharing about your journey today and thank you for your time.

Amy Douglas: Well, thank you for inviting me. I’m thrilled to be here. I’m excited for our conversation. Grief is not something that we all love to touch on but reflecting on it and empowering ourselves to move through it’s such a critical part of our own evolution and definitely human design. I feel like in my journey with human design. If I were to say, you know, that I have felt grief by learning my design, it was the grief of not allowing myself to be what I chose for myself for so many years. And the grief of thinking or feeling that those ways that I chose for myself and my design were wrong because they’re not it’s just sad, we’re so full of not enoughness and design hasn’t powered me to release a lot of that, not enoughness, offer some deep compassion and understanding for myself and others. I love your quote. It’s so true. I see so many people looking to others for the answers, the right ways to do things, and they’re all within us. We just really get to take the time, to sit with ourselves, to uncover that.

Victoria Volk: People might not be familiar with human design can you just briefly cover what that is? And also too, like, we are both manifestors design, which is only like nine percent of the population and often the most misunderstood. So imagine the grief that that has caused us in our lives alone.

Amy Douglas: So true in being female manifestors. Right? Like, there’s there’s so many layers to it. So human design is, another one of those architectural ways to help us discern, kind of who we are. But there are a lot of different modalities that were brought in together, but I want you to just if you hear nothing else, it’s basically the blueprint or the owner’s manual, operators manual, that you chose for yourself to tell you how you are meant to be existing in this three-d experience. And who knew? We had an owner’s manual that told us so many ways like how we’re meant to make decisions, and how we process fear, and how we’re meant to digest food and life there’s, I mean, down to so many things that it really just offers you the opportunity to say, oh, this is what I chose for myself. Very much to your point instead of looking to others to help point us in it, quote unquote, right direction.

Victoria Volk: And I imagine like me who’s just now starting to get down the human design rabbit hole again after I dabbled in it maybe a year ago and just coming back to it now. But or human design, how did you navigate life without this manual? And what was your life experience before coming into human design?

Amy Douglas: So, I think I’m probably not different than many. We use our eyes and ears. To show us what is the path that we’re meant to take. And so whether that is witnessing it from loved ones, having someone tell you how to be and how to show up. I had a lot of that in my household. I’m the youngest of three girls. There was a lot of like this, be like this, don’t say that, don’t do that, don’t be too much, did it at, like, not necessarily the Barbie monologue, but you could probably put some words to that as well. And so I was trying to run at a pace in my life that I had witnessed was the way like, there was a lot of pride and applause for being really busy doing a lot of things and not like being quote unquote lazy there. That was a really that l word was really kind of ingrained into our household. We were not gonna tolerate laziness Well, can we redefine what lazy is? Because like, I mean, we all have the opportunity to sit and be with who we are.

Amy Douglas: I think a big pivotal change for me that led to a lot of grief in my life in twenty fourteen. I had a lot of loss in my family. I lost my dad in April. He was only sixty seven and had been battling a lot of hard stuff for nine years. So, we kind of said he had nine lives. And the last one was the taker. And then shortly after that, my mom became very ill. A lot of it was grief. Let’s be honest. They’ve been together their whole life. She ended up spending the entire summer in the hospital almost lost her a couple times. She had severe ulcerative colitis and thankfully, she’s got it at bay, but it was really challenging to negotiate and navigate her being in the hospital after losing dad. And her grieving in the hospital, in a hospital bed was traumatic. And then not no sooner did we get her home and my brother-in-law dropped dead in the shower. I mean, my mom and my sister within four months becoming widows together, it just was insurmountable. And yet I was kind of the rock in the family. Like, we’re all gonna be fine. I’ll help take care of everything. And that’s kind of what I did. I never really let myself feel anything. And honestly, to be real just completely transparent, I kinda like shut off my heart after my divorce about five years before that. I kinda just said, alright, my husband of seventeen years been together twenty, father both of my children left with my best friend. I don’t know where to process that, so I won’t I’m just gonna put on the happy face and exist. Run at the pace that I know will have me running away from any of those feelings. And then fast forward losing, so many family members and just a lot of grief with that.

Amy Douglas: And then in twenty fifteen, my dog who’d got me through my divorce and was only four years old, was diagnosed with lymphoma, and I’m like, oh, hell no, that’s the one person in that note has seen witnessed everything, one person, one thing that had witnessed everything. And so then, you know, whenever I lost him toward the end of fifteen. I was like, what the hell am I doing? And sixteen just really started a deep journey of just my own self discovery and just a lot of letting go of ways of thinking that I had to be. Really giving myself the opportunity to be very curious what I was feeling in my life. Started my journey. I hired a coach. I didn’t I mean, from the Midwest. We didn’t know what those words but my good friend, Google said that’s what you need sunshine if you’re gonna pull out of this. And so I hired a coach out of the West Coast and I was still a very much a trust bit verify kind of person. So it felt only right for me to get the education myself didn’t tell Seoul, did everything under the radar. I wasn’t allowed to moonlight in my corporate life that I was still running a ridiculous pace at. And I empowered myself through lots and lots of deconditioning, lots of letting go, which is the practice that you use in the coaching modalities and just the healing spaces of the world. In twenty nineteen, the beginning of twenty nineteen, I quit my corporate life. And that’s the year that design brought itself into my experience. And I was like, okay, I know now that I’m ready for you, but I had to do for myself a lot of the layers of letting go and, you know, getting curious versus and dropping judgment and letting myself feel things again for the first time. I hadn’t done that. I really shut that part of me off. And design came when it was meant to, and I think it does for many. I resisted it first I was like, oh my god. Just another thing to tell me, whatever. But it wasn’t a questionnaire. I wasn’t answering questions, I know how to manipulate those to get the letters I want or the data that I want. This is very specific information about your birth details. So you can’t really fake those. And it just led to just a really beautiful way of me embodying and trusting myself and believing in myself and allowing me to be unapologetically me, which is what I said I was gonna do when I left my corporate life and I think human design was the open permissions slip to do that for me.

Victoria Volk: Was there a certain moment? Do you remember where you were? What you were doing? Like this was there like this aha moment or was this was there a certain thing? Or thought or experience. Because sometimes we have these pivotal moments, right, that just change the trajectory of our life. Like, because I know so many people who might be in the corporate hamster wheel, who are scared to leave that behind, who desire to venture onto something that is a more authentic expression of who they are. What do you say to those people? How did you do that?

Amy Douglas: In July of twenty eighteen, when I was still going through well, I was in a mastermind with a bunch of coaches, and we were all supporting each other and just I never thought I was gonna lead my corporate life. Like, that wasn’t even in my radar. I was a single mom raising my children on my own. Right? And I had one daughter that was in a private college that was ridiculously expensive. The labeling of it was irresponsible. Right? If I did that. It was safe and secure for me to stay where I was even though I was really it was becoming very clear that I was miserable. My body, our body is our greatest messenger. And from about twenty sixteen, and I’m sure this was very, very grief-related, I started having all these warning signs. My hair was falling now. I had extreme insomnia. I thought for sure that I was gonna have a heart attack in my sleep and my children were gonna find me dead in the morning. Just all these terrible fears, Western medicine, is like your picture health. I am an avid exercise or eat really healthy, meditate, I all the things. And yet, what was I dismissing? What was I not paying attention to? So I think for me to answer your question in July of twenty eighteen, I wrote a contract I was at a conference with a bunch of my peer coaches. And I wrote a contract with myself of what it was gonna take for me to actually leave my corporate life. Like, I’d been ruminating on that all of twenty eighteen. Like, could I do this? Is this really what I want? Can I be free? Like, freedom has been my word since my divorce and peace, which is the signature of a manifestor, okay, has been something that I have been for lack of a better word victory chasing like, okay. What does that feel like? When am I gonna know when I have it? What’s available to me when I do? And so I wrote this contract out, very logically very corporate intense. It’s like these things must be true in order for me to leave. And my peer coaches just gave me a little, a little tap. I had them sign it as my witnesses. I was like, okay, I’m making this contract. These things must come true. And one by one over the course of the next six months, I just they were all limiting beliefs and I just let all of them go. One by one. Those were things I did not have to note that did not have to be true because they were limitations. What are limiting beliefs? They’re beliefs that limit you. From the thing that you wanna be having, being, or doing. And so by December, it was just like, oh, yeah, I’m doing this. Actually, I was on vacation in November. And I said to another couple, well, I’m leaving my corporate life in January. That’s the first time I’d set it out loud. Then I was like, oh, and very manifestor like Right? Say it out loud, and then it becomes your reality. And then by the time I did it on January second, it was a transaction. It was like it was already done. And so I think the aha was actually that contract witnessing my peers going, wow, she’s still really holding herself back without saying those words. Right? Just being intuitive enough to witness their receipts of whatever I was trying to create for myself. And then doing the work to show myself. I didn’t have to have all of these things in place because again, I was creating that safety and security which is not allowing yourself to really take the leap for what you want in your life. And I finally did.

Victoria Volk: I don’t want to gloss over all of the losses that you just scribed before. And but I also wanna talk about this the idea of fear. So can we go back in time though to that divorce? And do you think that that was a catalyst for you to start coming into your own? Really?

Amy Douglas: Oh, my heavens. Yes. I used to make a joke. Like, it was and it’s very, like, I hear it in bitterness now, but it’s like, I take a vote and I always win. What I need to do for this and who gets to do that. And I used to say, but I’m like, how do you do it? How do you do everything on your own? I’m like, well, I figured out that once he left, the only thing he really did that I wasn’t already capable of doing was put the Christmas tree in the Christmas tree stands and open the pickle jar. So I stopped buying pickles. That was easy. And every time I bought a Christmas tree here, I did that, I brought the Christmas tree stand to the Christmas tree farm and had them install it because I can. So it’s just do you see, like, it was just like, did I have the avoidant attachment style. I have now I understand that I have that. And so it’s like, I didn’t need them anyway, type of energy. But it did really empower me to be like, okay, I now get to look at what I in those in those days, I was still saying what I need to do, what I should be doing, what I have to do. I don’t use any of those words anymore. Need, should, and have to, are full of resistance. It’s what I get to do. And it took me a couple years to get there, right? Because I was still really proving my open heart, proving to myself that I could do this. I didn’t need him. I’m good, losing my best friend along with it was hard. That grief is real. It still stings. And just people through your most trusted people in your life gone in a flash and that image of what your life was. It was real. It was really beautiful life. And I remember sitting in the car with my kiddos, we were getting ready to go into a movie. Same year of the divorce. And it just was somber because we used to go to the movies as a divorce, and it was one of our favorite things to do. And I just presidential. I turned the car off. And before we went into the theater, I said, I’m aware there’s only three of us in here. And yet, I’m so grateful that there’s the three of us in here. So how can we make this the best that it can possibly be? And I think that was a real catalyst for all three of us to just be like, okay, we can grieve the loss and we still do. And yet, we can create something different. And that helped us crawl out of a lot. I think because we just prescient it. We were honest about what we were feeling. We kinda did this thing of what are we sitting in the car, staying in the car. So if you’re mad about things or just it’s okay. It’s safe in the car. Safe in the car. And then it’ll stay in the car when we get out. We don’t have to take it with us, you know. We just tried to create some spaces that felt like we’re not gonna be judged for how we’re feeling. Right?

Victoria Volk: I love that. I love that idea. How old were your children at the time?

Amy Douglas: So they would have been Ten and twelve. Yeah. Nine and eleven, ten and twelve, those were some really really hard in eleven and thirteen because Yeah. Those were some really hard years. Yeah. I think, honestly, Victoria, My son just turned twenty three. He has had a major health journey this year. Oh, my goodness. And I think we are both. He’s also an emotional manifestor like us. And I think he is allowing himself to grieve the loss of his childhood, Mhmm. And I’m so proud of him doing it now. And not waiting and carrying it all these years. He’s like, maybe I should’ve waited a couple years, like, till I got out of college and I’m like, you. Happens when we’re meant to, let’s not let’s not resist it.

Victoria Volk: And the best friend. I mean, I imagine too, like, in the relationship you had an extended, like, in your friendship with her, but in your marriage with your husband, you had not just those relationships, but you had circles of friends. Right? And so it’s not just the husband and it’s not just the best friend, it’s the circle of friends, too. Like Mhmm. Was everything just gone and one fell swoop? Like,

Amy Douglas: Yes. Yes. Yes. And we were not from the town that we were in, that this happened, we were, transplants. And we hadn’t been here long enough to really I mean, you know, three or four years just doesn’t feel like long enough where, she and her husband were lifers. Well, now, ex husband were lifers and there was just a lot of scrutiny, a lot of harshness on myself and my children. And the sporting events that you would look forward to going to. Now we’re just so isolating and dreadful. And praying the kids weren’t treated differently, but both of them were. It was just terrible. It was because they had kids and their kids were the same age as our kids and the same gender and so in the same classes and

Victoria Volk: Oh my gosh.

Amy Douglas: A lot of finger-pointing, a lot of assumptions. And while I used to say I just grew really thick skin, I think it was just the epitome of learning that what other people thought about me were none of my business because what really mattered was what I thought about me. That’s the only way I knew how to keep moving forward because I knew I was a good person. I knew that I was gonna come out of this. I knew my children were amazing. And yet, man, just a lot. I tried to get them to just like, you know what? We’re just gonna travel. I’m gonna get a tutor. Run do our own lives, but, you know, too much change, just way too much change for everything. So

Victoria Volk: I’m glad you mentioned that because my next question was going to be, did you ever just consider, like, packing all your bags and just going somewhere else and starting over and making a fresh start and without all of these reminders. I mean, whether your husband passes away or whether you get a divorce or whether it’s this scandal scandalous relationship that you’re describing, where it’s two couples, families are being torn apart. It can be very easy to just, again, like you said, add on more change in things. What like, to have the self-awareness about that, like, and to have really the courage and the strength, to stand up to it. Mhmm. I don’t know a lot of people like you. I’m just gonna say that. I mean, I mean, I’ve been doing this podcast for four years and just knowing the nature of grief and the trauma that had probably on you and your life and your kids. Most people would have just ran the other way. I never think, what was it? You think that

Amy Douglas: My daughter, she’s my oldest, and I put the house on the market. I didn’t. It was a big house. We lived on a lot of acres. We had a horse farm because my daughter used to gloved ride horses, and it was gonna be a lot to just take care of and maintenance and expensive, etcetera. And she just begged. She just said, can we just not change this? And I said, okay. We won’t change the physical location, but we are changing the energy of the inside, and we just changed so many things. I repainted everybody new furniture made rooms, different rooms just to create a totally so it wasn’t like, oh, I remember sitting in here as a family. Right? I just It was like just giving ourselves a quote unquote facelift, just like, okay. If we can’t move and create a new experience somewhere else, we’re going to create a new one here for ourselves. And I’m like, or whatever color you want your room, whatever furniture you want. Like, if you had want bunk beds because you’re done with this, let’s just change it up. Let’s change everything that we can and see what it feels like. Open g center, all three of us, so that felt really good for us. And I would have escaped in a heartbeat. And yet, I really needed to honor where they were. And when they came home and wounded by something that was said. We just I pressed it for him. I just let them talk about it and shared with them kinda what I just shared it’s not really any of our business. And I know they chose to share what they were feeling, but they don’t know us. And you’re the one that gets to look in the mirror every day and lay your head on your pillow every night. So just choose how you want to feel about yourself and that little eye rubber your glue. Whatever bounces off me, sticks to you. Like hold that little childhood chant as best you can and don’t be afraid to tell others if someone has wronged you because we’re not here to take it all in and not get any support. I had them through, counseling if they needed it. I ended up with a life coach for my daughter. That’s what really counseling just was hard. And they just wanted to keep repeating what you’d been going through, and she just wanted she’s like, I don’t wanna feel this anymore. I wanna look at where I am and look at where I’m going and that’s what coaching offers. And it was so pivotal for her. I mean, she and my ex-husband were they were, like, two peas in a pod. So that was hard. She and I thought to be out the female in the We both wanted to raise my son and now we both celebrate that we both raised my son. But it was a big dynamic change in the house. It was a lot to adjust too. And while I did a lot of my own morning and grieving after they were at bed at night, I just didn’t really want them to know that I was going through that for some reason. Now they have both their twenty three and twenty five and have both said to me, god, mom, why’d you make it look so easy? And now I wish I wouldn’t have. But yet, I was doing the best I could with what I had new then. And now I’m honest and I share with them how dreadful it was. How unbelievably hard and I thought many mornings they would find me, in my bed, gone. And while I’m grateful for the ways that I have learned, I tell them all the time I raised you through a lot of my unresolved issues, unresolved traumas, unresolved grief, and I can help presence anything that you’re feeling now, and there’s nothing wrong with anything that you’re feeling. And that feels really good to just be able to have we are the closest tight-knit threesome, and it’s fun because my daughter marrying down my son. It’s inevitable. And just like building that and deepening that, it’s so fun to be a part of. But yet, there’s nothing that’s off limits that we talk about anything and everything. And I don’t know that we would have victory if we would have stayed married. I think we would have lived in that paradigm that, okay, we’re the adults and you’re the kids, and I just let all of that go. Nope, we’re all equals here. Everybody gets a voice. So thank goodness for that.

Victoria Volk: I had full body chills as you were sharing just about the, like, because what I heard what so many grievers do is they put on this armor to be strong for everybody around them. And so what I hear you saying is that you wished you would have dropped that armor in front of them. Mhmm. More.

Amy Douglas: And as I said, our body is our greatest messenger, grief is trapped in our body for sure. And I know that what was happening when my body was sending me louder and louder messages. And so finally, I started listening. I you know, before I just had the headphones on and the, like, the little of those things called the little blenders, you know, it’s like, I gotta move forward. Everything’s forward. Everything’s forward, I’ve gotta show them, you know, I’ll take on all their pain, so they don’t have to feel it. You know? And that wasn’t the answer either. But yet, at the time, it was the solution that felt most aligned until it didn’t And then once I started doing my own work and sharing it with them, you can hear it in them, you know, my coaching, what was what was happening for me, I started embodying and then there’s that ripple effect and my son just latched onto it like, Thank goodness. My daughter was a little more resistant. She’s got a little more energy in her design than I do, and she’s like, I know more than you, and they both do. Which is brilliant. My kids are my greatest teachers by far, but we were all open to hearing each other, giving each other the space to share who we were, what we were feeling And I’m grateful for that. And I’m grateful for the messages my body kept giving me. Otherwise, I would have kept up the facade that I’d built so well for myself, very intentionally because I didn’t want anybody to think that there was anything wrong. I’m fine. Everything’s fine. I’m always fine. I’ve had a friend tell me before. I never know if you’re happy. I never know if you’re sad. I never know if you’re hurting. Because you just show up and you listen in such a beautiful way. And I remember thinking, I don’t wanna do that anymore. I can be unapologetically me. That’s just the language that I knew when I left my corporate life. That’s that’s what I was choosing.

Victoria Volk: Which brings me to a question of when do you feel like it’s the manifestor type, and we’ll get into the types maybe yet in this episode or maybe not. If not, we’ll we’re gonna do a part two, friends. We’ll do a part two, and it’ll be all about human design because I love that rabbit hole, but do you feel like for a manifestor specifically anyone listening as a manifestor type, which you can find on or can you find that out?

Amy Douglas: My body graph is probably the easiest one. So and you need to know your birth time, hour, and minute your birth location, city and state, country, whatever that is, and then obviously your date of birth. Most people know that one without question. But that time and the location could be a little tricky. So those are just three important things. You plug them in and butter bing, butter boom, it spits it out for you.

Victoria Volk: So if you find out you are a manifestor, my question is, do you feel like it’s a manifestor thing that we really don’t allow ourselves to be held. We really don’t allow ourselves. Like, is it a manifestor thing? Do you see?

Amy Douglas: So much. So much. And we have what’s referred to as a closed protective aura. So we’re not easily read. We’re very mysterious. So because we’re not easily read and I had built a facade for myself that no one could see, I was impenetrable. Right? Like, unless I was sharing. And oftentimes now that I do understand that I am really, really meant to share my emotional experiences It helps others. That unlocked such as, like, wait. People wanna know this. People want to hear what I’ve been through. I thought that’s what I did for others. It just And I think, our aura doesn’t empower us to Like, we kind of we’re, like, a little bit off the, you know, like, I’m not sure. A little standoffish. Is this safe? Do I wanna be a part of this? You know? Or oh my goodness, is this gonna be exhausting once I get in? We don’t have the same level of energy as, seventy percent of our counterparts. So I think I’d always been juggling some of that, but just dismissing it, which is why my body got louder and louder, you know. A lot of adrenal fatigue, that’s not uncommon at all with manifestors by any stretch. Not knowing when an up is enough. We do not have that sacral energy that our counterparts do. And so and then you combine that with my open heart, which is, again, lots of human design lingo, but you put those two together and we just we don’t know enough is enough. And I sure didn’t, I was just like, nope, I have to do this. I have to, that’s just the way that and then I started softening and I was like, oh, no, I don’t. And I love my life so much differently than I did before. I love myself differently before because if I woulda loved myself, I wouldn’t have had to build a facade. Right?

Victoria Volk: Mhmm.

Amy Douglas: Because I wanted people to see me a certain way. And now I don’t care what people see because I know who I am and the right people I will be attracted to and will attract back to me to them.

Victoria Volk: Do you feel like there is a period of time where you were looking back at all of your friendships and relationships with people on just thinking how not fake but not authentic. Because if you’re not showing up, knowing who you are, knowing what you bring to the table, understanding what your desires and needs and wants are, you’re showing up for whatever that person wants you to be. So there’s no truth and honesty in that relationship.

Amy Douglas: Actually, I have put a lot of thought into this and a lot of my learning through design. So I have an undefined g center like you. And we’re really we are chameleons and we’re meant to’s, I did have someone say to me once, cut your suit different with your corporate people. And then with your kiddos, you’re so different. And then when you hang out with us, group, you’re so different. We’re meant to. We’re meant to because we’re trying those things on and then allowing ourselves to is this kind of like, which how do I wanna mold and what do I wanna do? So I’m grateful for the years. I allowed myself to do that. I think it felt right in the moment. I think there were things that I was craving that I thought that I could get with some of the connections I was in. And once I started doing my own growth journey that really started in twenty sixteen, I was realizing the toxicity in some of the choices once I was learning more about myself. But until then, I really do feel like my connections were genuine, but I don’t know if they were for migrate or good. I think it was because, oh, they needed something from me. And I felt good about giving that. And while I still get to do that in relationship that I have, that’s not what I’m most drawn to anymore. And a lot of my growth led to letting go of people in my life. And thankfully, I’m designed that it is relatively easy and comfortable for me, and I know it’s not for the other, but it’s not mine to carry. The longer I hold onto it, the more I’m resisting what’s really meant for me. And that has become an easier and easier process for myself, especially learning my design, and the connections that I crave and desire, but I didn’t realize how much I loved my own alone time. That’s very, very common for manifestors too.

Victoria Volk: I very much do too. Mhmm. So what was the role of fear in all of that life experience as you were going through all of that. And can you speak to, like, fear in our human design just a little bit? In your human design and just.

Amy Douglas: Yeah. So a lot of the fear is housed in the spleen, which is one of the nine centers that builds the body graph of human design. I have a defined spleen as to you. And so what when we have something and I’m using that word defined, It just means that we have consistent access to the energy that’s in that center. And the spleen is very instinctual, it’s very primal. Right? The bears coming, I must run. Okay? Let’s face it folks. We don’t have a lot of bears chasing us anymore. But we still are wired to feel that fight or flight. And I think the only fear that I feel like I have connected to in my life. Like, last year, I was living in Florida, and hurricane in came. And I had no fear for it whatsoever. And I was sitting in the eye for hours and everything around me was completely destroyed. I never even lost power, I lost connection with the outside world because we lost wifi, which was devastating for my six-month pregnant daughter. And I wish I could take that back because she has an undefined spleen. So what that means for her, she doesn’t have a consistent way to process that fear. And so it’s like, fear of not enoughness, fear of rejection, fear of repeating past mistakes. There’s a lot of that that’s housed in that center where I don’t feel a lot of that. I think my fear way back before I started my own journey was, what will everyone else think? And now I couldn’t care less, or how am I gonna screw up my kids? That’s the heaviest fear in the world. Is how can I make this easier for my children? Because they didn’t ask for this. And I’m an adult and they’re not emotionally mature enough to navigate this. Quite frankly, I wasn’t even sure if I was. Because as you heard me say early on, I just buried it down. I’m a thirty five year recovering binge eater. They never knew I was doing that. Hell, my ex-husband never even knew, but I was a binge eater. Right? I know how to hide things. But what was I hiding from? Basically, myself. And so I am thankful I’m also in my profile, I’m three in human design. And so I am just like, hey, run out there and see how this works or not. And I have done that my whole life. And I don’t have a lot of fear with like, when I moved to Florida, everybody was like, oh my god. You’re leaving everything behind. I’m like, I know is it great? They’re like, you don’t know anybody. I’m like, nope. Do you even know where you’re gonna live? Yes. I secured that online, like everybody else in the world, I have a lot of that energy about myself anyway, and I don’t go into with, like, I think that contract with myself in July of twenty eighteen has helped a lot in my journaling of flushing out any limiting beliefs that somebody might label as fear. Mhmm. And I just don’t I don’t like fear and excitement or born in the same place in our body. It’s our mind that labels it as such. And so I choose excitement. That’s what I choose.

Victoria Volk: I love that. One thing we talked about before we started recording was because you have so much loss. This is where I’m, like, where do we start? Right? And I had my losses starting very early on in my life. I was a young child. And so I feel like I’ve gotten the worst part kind of over with. Hopefully, I mean, I pray that that’s the case. Right? But before we start recording, we were talking about how we both share that. Thirty five, thirty six channel. It’s that channel of emotional experiences. And I also have what did you say? I had the incarnation cross. There’s I mean, we keep going too.

Amy Douglas: Yeah. You have thirty five in your cross. So that it’s definitely a part of, you know and thirty five is more of that element of, like, desiring change and the thirty six part of it is that crises energy. It’s like something chaotic. There’s emotional turbulence in your life. And so then that kind of pushes you to the throat center of like, okay, what can I change? The biggest part of that wave, that abstract wave is what that thirty five, thirty six is referred to. It’s very emotionally volatile, is our expectations. And think about what we have in the world of expectations. Right? Of others, of the world, of our own experiences, etcetera. And this piece of my design has been absolutely life-changing for me to connect with because I didn’t realize how much chaos I was creating my own life by having these expectations out there. I cannot have expectations of others or anything that is outside of my air coating control because I want control in the highest vibration. Control is a core wound for manifestors. We don’t wanna be controlled, and we don’t wanna be controlling. And I’ve been on both sides of those that fence for sure. And so when I learned this about myself, it’s like, oh, I can drop the expectations. Like, my partner would say something to me and I hung onto it like it was the law. We were doing this. Right? Like, oh my gosh. And then when we didn’t because he’d forgotten he’d even said it, I’m like, I made it mean something about me. Like, I wasn’t worthy, I wasn’t deserving, and of course, or going back to that attachment. Well, I didn’t need it anyway. Right, that avoidant attachment. I didn’t want that anyway. And now, I just have a lot more clarity. And when he does have all these ideas and suggestions, It’s just like a little fluffy cloud and I let it float on by and I don’t hang on to it like the law. It’s more of like wouldn’t it be nice if? Type of energy, and then any expectations I have on myself, I really want to check-in on those. Am I being hard on myself again? Am I trying to prove something? I have nothing to prove. I’m enough exactly as I am. I have enough. I know enough. I am enough. And that has been a critical part of my journey. And then sharing that with others, like, especially if I see someone like you, Victoria, who has this wave. It’s like, what are we expecting? And who are we expecting it of? And how can we allow ourselves to release a lot of that? Because then it will really, you know, that way it won’t hit a way that it could if we have these expectations. And then just noticing that we’re meant to share those experiences as well it really is a game changer for a lot of people. We’re not meant to just harbor them ourselves at all. And that was that was something that I just I thought was unheard of. Why would anybody else wanna hear my trials and tribulations? Well, because it invites others to share those too, and that’s how we move through these things. And we move grief and disappointment and disgust, all those things through us when we empower ourselves to talk about it.

Victoria Volk: And then you can weave in what kind of energy type you are. If you’d have the thirty five, thirty six. Yeah. So if you are a manifesting generator or a generator, like, go do some exercises, go work out, like, just do some high impact stuff, right, to get those emotions out. But as a manifestor, is it the same? Like, to do the same? Like, what’s

Amy Douglas: So it really depends on the mechanics of your design. I have a defined route, and my route is connected to my spleen. And so that has me being someone who is really meant for movement, but any emotionality find your practice. Some people it might be meditation, just really quiet stillness. Right? Some people it might be really cathartic, like just especially as manifestors. I had my podcast co-host get me a damn it doll. You heard of those?

Victoria Volk: No.

Amy Douglas: Oh my gosh. So it’s this little doll that’s all fluffy and it’s like I can use it to hit things. Right? Or throw things or I can act as if I’m gonna pull its legs off And at first, I was like, oh, that’s so harsh, but it is so cathartic. Like, I invite clients to, like, get their anger out on pillows. And letting yourself move through it, throw access, like just move through it, you’re be surprised, dance it out, shake it off, whatever that practice can be, there are symptoms based on your mechanics of how you might do that, that anybody that is feeling something emotional, find a way to let yourself let it out holding it in is literally the worst thing you can do for yourself. But yet, that’s what I was taught Victoria. Like, nope. Suck that back in. Do not share that. And so then I stuffed it down. Stuffed it down. Stuffed it down.

Victoria Volk: And particularly as manifestors anger.

Amy Douglas: Yeah. Oh, yeah.

Victoria Volk: Don’t show your anger.

Amy Douglas: And this is my son who referenced, is an emotional manifestor. That’s something he said to me recently. Thank you mom for letting me witness your anger. Because instead of, like, my daughter had a very sensitive head, and that was not the most patient person, manifestors typically aren’t doing her hair in the morning before school, before I had to go to work, it’s like all of these things. And then she, you know, they would hurt, and I have to go slower. And more than one brushes were broken. Thankfully, I never used it on her, but I would throw them or smack them down on the counter to get my anger out. And it is important that we let ourselves do that. And my son who has a lot of that anger, certainly at his age too, like things aren’t going your way. Like, letting yourself let it out, fear of judgment or shame. There is no shame in those expressions. Let it out. It often has a great message. Right? We’re misaligned with something.

Victoria Volk: For sure. And I think about too, like, in that thirty five, thirty six, what’s been helpful for me is recognizing that when you were talking about expectations, like the grief that causes us, the self-suffering that we put ourselves through by, it’s like, like you said, when someone says something you take as you take them at their word. Right? And so we can find ourselves in these situations where, well, this is how it’s always been. It’s always been this way. We’ve always we’ve always been this way. It’s different now. You’re different now. Is it a self-practice? Or is this something to communicate with the people in our lives Like, does the human design help us find the language to communicate this?

Amy Douglas: Yes.

Victoria Volk: These things?

Amy Douglas: Yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, a hundred percent. And again, going back to what the activations are in your design helps you share and empowers you to share your truth. And I think it’s a you said, is it this or is it that? And I wanted to say yes. Yes and both. You have to find your own practice. Wow. I just said, have to. You get to find your own practice. Right? It is important that you find a way to connect that you feel that release. You and I, Victoria, we will feel peace with that release. Right? We also will find peace we’re sharing it with others. It’s important based on our mechanics. Our connection from where all those emotions are coming from, from go straight to the throat. They are meant to be expressed. But somebody else’s mechanics in their design might look different, and so I can help invite them in the ways that they can allow and empower themselves to get through that too. But I do believe, especially in this instance for you and I, it’s a hundred percent both. I don’t think people are meant to just keep things in. That’s not safe. And I don’t care if it is an expression of like they do it in a journal or they they write a book or they have an audio file that they add to daily. I went in December of twenty two, so almost a year ago, I moved from doing a written handwritten journal to an audio app that I speak into. It transcribes it if I wanna see other words, but then I also get to listen to the emotionality of what I was feeling and experiencing. I was a very turbulent time of my life. I was thrust out of Florida where I was loving my life because my daughter was having a terrible pregnancy and I couldn’t not be there with her. I knew I didn’t want to go to Michigan in the winter. Are you kidding me? I didn’t want anything to go north. Right? And yet I did. And it was very I was holding her and her fear and her concerns and the status of her health and all of those things. And if I wouldn’t have created that practice for myself to let it out, journaling just felt like writing it down. I felt like I was filtering it. Felt like I was like, what if she found this? What if she came over and found what I was and in the audio file, it just felt safer trapped in my phone. I don’t know. You find the practice that empowers you to let it out. That’s what I’m offering.

Victoria Volk: I love that. And I think that’s a brilliant place to and this recording today. But first, I wanna give you an opportunity. And you’ve shared so much, and I feel like I do feel like I’ve glossed over so much of your losses because it’s a lot and I feel like each one of these could have their own episode. I mean, really, truthfully, I feel like I’m doing a disservice to you and your grief and to my listeners. I really do. Like, I feel like I’m shortchanging your story here. I’m giving emotional and I don’t know. I don’t know why. I mean, I know why because I’m emotional, but it’s so much. Yeah.

Amy Douglas: And yet, you give me the space to share. And this is what I’m meant to do. Right? This is what I’m meant to do. And I’m double-barreled, is what it’s referred to.
So both of my emotional waves go from my solar plexus to my throat, our emotional center to our communication center, And so one kind of softens the other. And so the way that I feel called to share it is empowering for me. And it’s like part of my deconditioning process because you gave me the space to share it. And if I don’t sound emotional about it, it’s because I’ve done the work to let myself say, it’s okay. I’ve been through it. I’ve navigated it. And now I am meant to share it so others can have their space. And feel empowered and safe and almost given permission to do it for themselves as well. So I don’t feel like it’s been glossed over. At all. Mhmm. I felt like you’ve given me the space to share. And if it helps someone else, oh, that feels so delicious to me.

Victoria Volk: To me as well. So thank you for sharing that. And I want to give you an opportunity to share how people can the different ways people can work with you. And we’ve got, the holidays are coming up. It’s we’re still in October yet, but the holidays are coming up, and you’d shared briefly or recorded recording. One of your offerings is a great Christmas gift, so please share how people can work with you and where can they find you.

Amy Douglas: So the best place to go, I’m not a big social media person. It’s not uncommon kind of in my manifestor world. But Amyadouglas.com is my website and that has and there’s a page for all of my offerings. If you’re curious about human design, the one that you’re referencing Victoria is that little audio file. I do about a twenty five minute mini reading. It is full of deliciousness. It’s like the first glance of everything I see about your design, and it’s so fun to share. I have a lot of moms that give it to their kiddos. Also, by the way, it’s so great for the moms to hear about their kiddos. Because we think how can they be mine.
We’re so different. Hello? We’re all different and we all choose. And it’s so beautiful to witness seen a mom and a child understand each other without those that hierarchical position. Right? So you can see that I also weave human design into a lot of the ways that I support others in coaching. And those offerings are on there as well. I have digital courses. So, and you can connect with me on what I think that’s probably just the best place. I will happily offer your listenership twenty five percent off of any reading. And I’ll give you a coupon code if you want me to have the coupon code be the name of your podcast. Does that feel

Victoria Volk: Yeah. Sure.

Amy Douglas: Most recorded for you. So The Unleashed Heart will be the coupon code

Victoria Volk: or grieving voices.

Amy Douglas: Grieving voices. Okay. The Unleashed Heart is your website. Right?

Victoria Volk: Yep. Yep.

Amy Douglas: Okay. So the coupon code will be Grieving Voices which would afford any of your listeners twenty five percent off of my human design offerings. And happy to connect. I even have, like, a little thirty minute call if you just wanna chat about what might be best for you. You can sign up for something like that as well.

Victoria Volk: Thank you so much for your time today, and your strength and your courage have I just adore you. I’ve gained so much I mean, I respected you before, but just hearing all that you’ve gone through and experienced, I really, as a manifestor to a fellow manifestor, like, thank you. Thank you for sharing. We are small, but we are strong in mighty in numbers. So the world needs you and the world needs all of us to understand ourselves better because like you said, it’s the ripple effects of that. And the work that we do within ourselves that changes the world. So Yeah. It’s pretty

Amy Douglas: Beautifully said. Yes. Thank you, Victoria. It’s been my absolute pleasure to be with you today.

Victoria Volk: And stay tuned for the part two to come out. We’ll get that scheduled soon because I really am excited to dive deep into all things human design. So until then, remember, when you unleash your heart, you unleash your life. Much love.

Ep 161 Dr. Amirah Hall Part II | Quantum Energy Tools to Discover Your Divine Design

Dr. Amirah Hall Part II | Quantum Energy Tools to Discover Your Divine Design

 

SHOW NOTES SUMMARY:

In this Part II episode with the previous guest, Dr. Amirah Hall, we dig deeper into the energetics of our life experience.

A near-death experience catapulted Amirah into a realm of energy work she had not anticipated finding herself doing. However, it’s also probably what saved her from herself. As she states in this episode, we tend to stand in our way.

Through a set of what she calls quantum energy tools, she developed a daily practice that is grounding and that initiates herself into the present moment. From a place of awareness, she shares a way that all of us can shed the parts of ourselves we’ve identified with that are not ourselves but an experience in our lives.

Amirah believes learning to manage our energy field is part of our purpose. She added that we need to remember the truth of who we are: we are light and energy.

RESOURCES:

CONNECT:

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Are you enjoying the podcast? Check out my bi-weekly newsletter, The Unleashed Letters.

CONNECT WITH VICTORIA: 

Victoria Volk: Thank you for tuning in to grieving voices. I am excited that you’ve hit play on this episode because this is part two with Dr. Amirah Hall. If you have not listened to episode one, it was episode one fifty-five and it went live and was published on August fifteenth twenty twenty-three, in that episode she talks about her experience of having an end of I’m an End life Doula, I had death on my mind I guess, a near-death experience while in Egypt and what that experience was like for her. But in this episode, I kind of wanted to dig into a little bit more about how the gift presented itself in her life and what that experience was like. And the skeptics that probably came along with that and probably the grief too of realizing yet you have this gift and what do you do with it? How do you use it for the good of humanity? And the impact it probably had on her life as well. Also, we’re gonna talk about some spiritual practices that all of us can do to sharpen our tool of intuition and maybe some advice too for empaths are highly sensitive people who are really sensitive to their environment or subtle energies and things like that. So I’m really excited to dig in. We’re gonna also talk about something that happened on the previous episode. So if you haven’t listened you’ll want to go back to a specific part of that first episode with Dr. Amirah Hall, and we’ll dig into that too a little bit. But Here we go. Thank you for joining me, Dr. Amirah Hall. Welcome back.

Victoria Volk: Thank you so much. It’s a real pleasure.

Victoria Volk: Okay. Well, let’s just start off by saying in the last episode around thirty-seven minutes and fifty-five seconds in around that time, you started talking about your experience of coming across Deepak Chopra, who was very helpful on your journey as you talked about in the last episode. But when I was editing that episode, there was an audible male, very distinct male voice that said yes. And I want you to go back to that first episode. I left it in intentionally. I had a little teaser in the show notes, so I don’t know if you caught it, if you did listen to it, but now go back and check it out. And this really ties into the skepticism that there might be out in the world because I had my entire family listened to it. I think I listened to it a dozen times myself. I am a natural skeptic. It takes a lot to I want the proof. Right? I’m always looking for the truth and the proof I want evidence. And as I’ve been working on myself more and more over the years, more understanding of energy and subtle energies and how I mean, I went from believing that when you died, you went in the ground and that was it, as a child like that was my understanding of death to becoming an end of life doula, understanding that death can be this beautiful transition, that it can be something that you can choose how it happens and plays out with dignity. If you are blessed with giving that choice, not a lot not everybody is. Right? With terminal illness. You have a you have a say in that. My perspective of death is greatly changed. Put it that way. So when you started to realize that this was your gift around where were you in your life? And how did you respond to that first knowing or inkling?

Dr. Amirah Hall: Well, I don’t know that it was look, I’m very much like you, very skeptical and discerning. And even though I had been a seeker of truth and light or spirituality for a good part of my life, I was still extremely skeptical. And because there were so many far out ideas, I think being somewhat dis being discerning period is a good thing. I think it’s sort of a protective and a guide to help us. But there’s a certain point when what literally happened was I was a six figure income earner back in nineteen ninety eight. I was doing extremely well. I was in sales for a high-tech industry, selling a service contracts for backup emergency power equipment. And I was doing really, really well. But when I came back after my near-death experience, my whole world fell apart. I was depressed again. I was lost. I was losing friends. I was explaining some of the situations and experiences I had in Egypt. We’re very metaphysical, very mysterious like watching going by these granite statues and then seeing one of them wink at you or watching a hand raise, their arms are straight by their side. And I literally saw like the hand lifted as if to wave at me while I was going that by. And I wasn’t the only one that saw it like, I would my mouth would drop and I would just literally go, like my eyes wide open. Did I just see that? Yes. And look to my left or my right and other people saw it too. And you’re like, well, that was our validation in the moment that we weren’t losing our minds. And so many mysterious things happened to us in that journey. When I came back home, and I tried to explain some of these things. I mean, it just goes off deaf ears. Right? It’s just people like, yeah. Right. What were you guys smoking something over there? Or why do you think that was so? Or maybe you were dehydrated? So So all these we had prepared ourselves. We’ve been meditating. We had we’re so immersed into letting go, letting go of our perception of what we think we know is true or not. I had no preconceived ideas of a granite statute waving at me. It was beyond my scope of possibilities. And so that that started everything. But then when I would interview, okay, so my life fell apart, lost my friends, quit my hobbies, I just wasn’t the same. I knew something was diaphragmatically different after my NDE. But when I started feeling somewhat better, I started interviewing. And going to a company and I’d get to the third interview thinking, okay, I got this it’s a slam dunk. Right? They didn’t hire me. And it happened three times where I get to the third interview, and then they didn’t take me on. So that was a critical moment for me and I remember the thought. Okay. I surrender. Now what? Now what? And I had been starting a process of learning how to release energy blocks that was my form of healing. When I found a healer that said to me, oh, you’ve got stuck energy. I went, great. Give me a path, give me a solution, give me the ABCs, one, two, three, whatever, I will do it. And that where I started. So I started feeling really good and started going back on my track, but universe shut me down. And like I said, I had no intention of doing this work professionally. And so I started to, I think it would I don’t even know if it was a realization that it was a gift. I didn’t think of it as a gift. I just knew it was now my purpose because what I’ve come to believe in training thousands of people over the last two decades is that everybody has the abilities. I don’t know that they’re gifts. I think it’s just a matter of us developing like, we can all learn to speak English. We can go learn French too. We can learn to write. We can some people learn to write poetry, and they start immediately, they’re good at it. But as they develop, it gets better and better and better. Same thing with a sculpture. We could all go learn the club take the class, but you might be exceptional at it. I might suck. Right? Or mine are pretty rugged. So we could all develop these abilities because they’re deep within us they like a statue, literally, we have to start carving and shedding the outer layers to reveal the inner beauty. It’s all there. I believe that our creator so magnificent has input us with this, let’s call it a software, let’s call it a divine design, and it’s there for us to discover. And so all of our journey is here to explore and to reveal that inner light, that power, that ability to shine or redirect in whatever capacity we’re ready or want to discover.

Victoria Volk: I mean, there’s a lot of people listening who can resonate and relate to their life falling apart and who have not had a near-death experience.

Dr. Amirah Hall: Right?

Victoria Volk: And so when you are in that lowest of lows, what are some suggestions for people to start to maybe open themselves up spiritually? Because I think what happens is, especially with grief, trauma, things like that, like we become spiritually thirsty. It Yes. Our spiritual life greatly suffers because we start to shut down, we start to, we don’t see ourselves clearly. We don’t see other people clearly. It’s almost like we’re zombies in our own life experience. You just going with emotions and on autopilot.

Dr. Amirah Hall: Yeah. I refer to that as walking in the land of paper dolls, sleepwalking. I was just going through the motions. And, yeah, life is bitter, ugly, flat, two dimensional and we become apathetic. We become detached. We are angry. We are angry and well depressed is sort of a broad extension or description of all the feelings, but lackluster unmotivated, just not given a shit how about anything or anybody? And it’s a deep-rooted anger and fear. So for me when I lost interest in my hobbies and my artwork, I was creating jewelry at the time. And I had built a business in selling internationally. And I just didn’t care anymore. Those were my signs. And I think when you’re that low for me, it got to a point where I didn’t have any family nearby. My family didn’t really get it what I was going through they were really detached also, they were in Canada. So I didn’t have a big support group at all. And so it came down to, I guess, a switch in my head like, if I’m gonna survive, I’m gonna have to do whatever it takes. And none of the other possibilities or what was presented to me, maybe it was I wasn’t suppose, remember this was back in nineteen ninety-eight.

Dr. Amirah Hall: So now we’ve got this plethora of resources. And that can also be overwhelming. I think it’s to the opposite extreme. Right? But I sort of plunked around until something resonated and that for me was energy work. Now when people say energy work today, it’s not the same. I know there’s a lot of energy workers listening to this, but hardening being sort of the old krona on the block here, I would say that a lot of people really haven’t done their work. That’s what I’m witnessing. They haven’t done the true deep work because they didn’t have a system that they could rely on consistently and or having a mentor that would stretch them, reach them beyond what that limit or that ceiling that they can’t see their subconscious mind.

Dr. Amirah Hall: So the tools that I learned were really about me surviving. It was just about me doing something different because I couldn’t take the pain anymore. And sometimes we just have to get to that breaking point of just going, I can’t effint take this anymore. I’m just done. So it’s either die, completely let yourself sink into that deepest abyss possible or okay, I’m gonna kick like if you’re being pulled in a current riptide, you just all of a sudden go, I’m gonna kick bloody hell. I am gonna kick so hard I’m gonna move out of this. And the tools that I teach, I call them quantum energy tools. They’re simple guided visualizations. And quite honestly, I didn’t believe in them when I started. But I’m just like, what the hell I got through? Yeah. I got nothing else here, so I’m gonna go for it. And I created these tools that I used to this day, myself, every single day, and all my students and all my trainings and all of the profound transformations that I’ve witnessed have been based on these basic principles. And the number one thing, whether you mentioned empaths, you mentioned sensitive people, you mentioned depressed people, you mentioned anybody that’s sick, we don’t know how to ground. Nobody taught us how to ground. Every device you buy now has three prongs on it. Right? The electrical appliances. The third prong is a grounding wire. Why? Because if there’s a surge of energy, if there’s a surge of something, it will not mow up your device. But we get served or bombarded all day long and we have no way to discharge. It gets stuck in what we don’t even understand is what I call the energy field, the aura. And some people think they know what it is. They say they wanna see it. Well, what? Why? If you see it, the reason is not to see, oh, you’ve got a happy life learning how to manage our energy field I believe is part of our purpose. All of us is as we remember the truth of who we are, it’s that you’re light, you are energy, and this energy is continually moving for anybody that says put up that white light around your or I’m gonna say. You know, to that, it because it’s almost like hitting the pause button on your remote control. It freezes everything. It slows everything down so nothing can move. The idea here is that we want to keep our energy moving. We want to release the block so back to grounding. So that’s the very first thing I teach based on so there’s all these devices now. I call them shiny objects you can go and you can, why the grounding mat and you put it under you while you’re working and you go or go out urthing as they say walking in the grass. Okay there may be some validity to that because I know I sure feel good when I go in nature and just let go. What do we do? Right? We just let go. Why? What is it about that energy that just helps us?

Dr. Amirah Hall: So I visualize from the base of my spine, I attach a cord. I like to imagine a laser beam or even a USB cord or a wire, and I have a magnet at the base of my spine, and I have a magnet at the center of the earth. And that line just invisibly is drawn to the center of the earth. And then boom. So you can ground right here and now and so can I? And we can be more present. What that almost does is it almost brings in our energy field. So the problem with empaths, I call them out of control healers because their energy field is so far and so wide It’s filling up the whole house or the whole building or the whole world, and everybody else’s energy field steps into theirs.

Dr. Amirah Hall: So we’ve not been taught how to bring that energy field into, let’s say, arms length around us. And when it’s arms length around us, it’s much easier to manage. Right? I teach a symbol on the edge of my aura so that people think where Amirah is out there in that symbol. So anybody looking for me or their energy or they don’t like something I say or they do Either way, that energy goes into that symbol, not into my energy field. So it’s a decoy not a protective field because you’re an idiot if you think you can protect yourself from energy moving, idiotic belief system.

Victoria Volk: I’m so glad you mentioned that, and I have never heard that perspective, but it it absolutely clicks with me because what I’m learning just as of late because that is the message. Right? Like, especially in my reiki training that was the message I received was imagine this ball of golden light wrapped around you and protecting you and it’s partly intention. Right? If the intention makes you feel good, but it’s still not going to stop your energy field from rubbing up, bumping up against your environment because everything is energy. And we’re always communicating with our little antennas. Right?

Dr. Amirah Hall: Well, it’s naive at. Right? And as we’re growing up as humans and learning about the quantum field, science is expanding. Right? And it merging with spirituality. There’s something to be said about the golden light, and I use that too. However, it’s not gonna protect you. And it is it is a high when you can bring it into the physical body gold is the highest frequency that we can hold in the physical body for an extended amount of time. It’s probably not going to stay there forever. But even if it’s for a few minutes or even if you realign with that high frequency, it changes the dynamics of everything within. Right? So, but there’s no absolutes to any of this. And anybody that’s talks about, oh, bring in red light for the first chakra and orange, but that’s BS too.

Dr. Amirah Hall. And here’s why I can say that is because I’ve got to how I really develop sense, a clairvoyant sense, but my third eye. So when I look at the energy of the second chakra, let’s say, our emotional center are empathic. We’re sucking it all up. Right? From everybody and everything. The news from I look at I’m picking up feelings and thoughts from people that are look there was a friend of mine in California, and I reached out to her I said, hey, is everything going okay with you? And she goes, oh, yeah. I’ve been thinking about you for the last couple weeks. Should we set up a. So I was feeling it. Right? So I reach out to her because her energy at some level was creeping in and finding a plug in to me because she wanted to communicate with me. So I hate people like that. I just wish they’d pick up the phone or I wish they’d send a text. Right?

Dr. Amirah Hall: But then I do that with my students too. I’m like, okay, I’m not sure who this is, so I start reaching out to everybody. Back to the second chakra, when when I look at any of the energy fields, I see wheels within wheels of spinning light. And the best way I can describe that is it looks to me like a kaleidoscope. Have you ever seen a kaleidoscope? Mhmm. So they’re moving. The patterns are always changing. The colors are always changing. Right? So how in god’s name can orange be the color to bring that into harmony? You, Victoria, might be needing to work on something that’s, let’s say, I don’t know. I mean, you’re looking for a recipe from your grandmother. There’s something with your grandmother that you’ve been feeling like you wanted to connect with or or demonstrate or resurrect. Right? Maybe a tradition. Well, it might be for you to bring that shocker into harmony might be a soft blue. Is blue to one of your favorite colors by the way?

Victoria Volk: It is my favorite color.

Dr. Amirah Hall: Because I see that. Yeah. So I just see that that’s more for you right now. Next week, it could be turquoise. It could be agreed. It could be a yellow. So as we evolve, as we resolve, and grow, and change, there’s other aspects to us that want some healing or looking for attention. And so those would be different colors that we might bring into that space to bring it into balance. Does that make sense how it works?

Victoria Volk: Absolutely. I mean, because you’re speaking my language of biofield tuning, which is using tuning forks in your energy field to, like, basically bring harmony through sound, to the energy field. And when you brought up the nature piece, I think what happens is our bodies become in sync. You know, it’s like those

Dr. Amirah Hall: We reverberate Yes. Up the vibes and they they help us they’re literally grounded.

Victoria Volk: Calibrating us.

Dr. Amirah Hall: Yes. They’ve got roots. What do they do? They’re grounded.

Victoria Volk: Yeah?

Dr. Amirah Hall: So we’re trying to remember that part of us, I think, when we go to nature, because we are interconnected to everything. And so we need help with that as humans because we’re so much in our intellect. We’re so busy our mind is just and so we don’t know how to have that balance. The trees are great teachers to us. So grounding is the number one thing.

Dr. Amirah Hall: The biggest problem I find empaths have. Highly sensitive individuals is they’re not grounded. And so then we work through the process of one, second most important thing is clearing energy that’s not you. Because the simple truth is when you start releasing what you’re not, your mother’s beliefs, your dad’s beliefs, the family patterns, your your unconscious biases, or thoughts that you had that, let’s say, that white light could protect you. Right? All of those belief systems, when we start reducing those, minimizing those, all of a sudden, the true you, the true essence, and the true gifts can just shine bright.

Victoria Volk: I resonate with that because the opposite of releasing who you’re not is getting to know who you are. Is getting to know of yourself,

Dr. Amirah Hall: But it happens gently in the process of releasing what you’re not.

Victoria Volk: Right? And that’s why too, like, every session in biofuel tuning is so different. Like, this session is the same just like you said. It’s like, right, you know, this analogy of peeling back the onion, but let’s say the artichoke you know, it’s like yeah, pulling back an artichoke. It’s the same. Like, once you get to the heart.

Dr. Amirah Hall: Yeah. I’m chiseling away at a piece of wood to create a sculpture or concrete. Yeah. And so I think tuning forks are awesome I know in ancient history, ancient mystery schools, they used sound walls, they used bells, they used rattles, to help us, that energy. It sends like a ripple. What I use is a tool that I explode things in my mind. So it’s like a stick of dynamite in my mind. Let’s say, I feel like some pain in in my left leg. And gee, I never felt that pain before. What is that? All pain is stuck energy. Whether it’s mental pain, emotional, spiritual, or physical, stuck energy. And so to release that block, I just didn’t visualize. Blowing up a stick of dynamite or another simple. And that gently releases it out of my field. So in a very short amount of time, so what I’m doing in and so the beauty of your tuning forks is it’s taking away stuff we don’t know about. The beauty of getting conscious to knowing what we’re clearing I find is a step in raising our conscious awareness because it is about being conscious. Conscious healers. And the and the other thing is tuning forks aren’t always available. Singing bowels or bells and those things aren’t always available. So for me, I the work I do is teaching independence. And self reliance.

Victoria Volk: I love that. So aside from the stick of dynamite, besides rounding and things like that like, these mental it’s all it’s really just using your imagination that can help

Dr. Amirah Hall: And that is clearvoyance. Most people don’t realize that. They say to me, I wanna open up my third eye. You know, this is like the big buzz. Right? The truth of it is is you’re doing it all. But you’re not conscious to what you’re doing. And so all those thoughts that you’re creating your experience with. So when we start using visualization, which is using your inner eye, using your inner abilities to connect with what you might call imagination, that’s really the same thing. And so when we direct the energy, then we are empowering ourselves for healing.

Victoria Volk: Is meditation a piece of your work as well?

Dr. Amirah Hall: Again, there’s thousands and thousands of different types of meditation. All the work I realized my efforts ended up directing me to and the NDE showed me proved to me is that I’m an energy being. However, I’m being a human right now. And in this human experience in the three d lace, we need practical experiences. Our job is to stay present. We are not present. We are not grounded and are consciously aware of what we’re doing from minute to minute. Have you ever been driving down the road and missed your exit?

Victoria Volk: Just happened the other day I was driving. I had to go somewhere and just totally just kept on driving.

Dr. Amirah Hall: Yeah. Have you opened an Amazon package and threw the thing that you bought in the garbage and held the package in your hand?

Victoria Volk: No, but I have looked for my cell phone when it’s been in my back pocket.

Dr. Amirah Hall: Have you ever cleaned off your dinner plate and thrown the fork right in the garbage with all the food, you know, stuff like that.

Victoria Volk: The mindless. Yep.

Dr. Amirah Hall: So that’s a moment where your spirit wasn’t present. You were to wear. You snapped out for just a nanosecond. In some cases driving past years and it was longer than that until you got back in your body and you realized, oh my god I’ve got now another five minutes because I gotta go back and forth. It’s learning how to be aware. Learning how to be present is the power of actual manifestation.

Victoria Volk: And I’m glad you mentioned that too, not just the manifestation piece, but because I can tie this to I can tie this to grief, I feel like I’m being called to in that when we are so emotionally wound up, and our energy is just bound up within us, it’s almost impossible to be present in that moment. And we can’t focus. You can’t concentrate. And so accidents more are more likely to happen. You’re more likely to get hurt or trip or fall or call the wrong person or weird stuff like that, but you don’t tie it to grief. You don’t tie it. Yeah.

Dr. Amirah Hall : And then the poor empath or a person that’s grieving, and then and the trauma is just building, and building and building and then you do, like, I did, you withdraw. Mhmm. And you stop really living and you stop we become a victim and blaming the big ugly world. But the truth is, it’s all us. It’s all us. Our creations.

Victoria Volk: And you know what? That’s empowering to know for anyone listening because you have the power to change it. That’s it.

Dr. Amirah Hall: Might not feel like it. Right? Believe me. It may it may not feel like it. I’ve been there where I’m like, oh, god. I just don’t and I for a whole year, I just barely dragged my butt to the class. And I sat there thinking, I’m seeing black. I’m not doing anything. And then all of a sudden, it was like the lights turned on. I was my own biggest enemy, and I was resistant in a lot of different ways. In ways that I didn’t even know I was, I wasn’t intentionally trying to be resistant. But that, you know, family programming and anger and fear and doubt were layer and layer and layer that just kept me living small. And it really was only just the last couple of years that I I mean, because of, I guess, so many things have changed in technology, and I guess I got sick and tired of seeing these charlatans and fraudsters out there professing lies to people and nontruth about this work and the truth behind being an impact that you don’t have to be use that as your crutch. I am an empath. I’m probably the biggest out of control healer. Right? It’s not something that you can unlearn and I don’t mean not to be compassionate. I mean learning how your energy is interfering in somebody else’s healing and you don’t even know it. You know, we, as empaths, we’re typically healers, wanna help people, wanna see everybody do better. Right? And feel good. But what makes me think that my energies actually gonna heal them. It’s a lie because that person’s energy needs to be their energy in their body and that needs to be refined so it can heal itself. It’s different than Amira’s energy. In fact, my energy and many of my students we always do an exercise of separating energies when we finish the class. Because energy between you and I is exchanging, even if you’re thousands of miles away. Anybody listening is probably feeling my energy.

Dr. Amirah Hall: So after this, I will be bringing my energy back. And so the same is true with all my clients is I give them their energy back as there’s an exchange. So the idea as we progress is we build a more condensed sphere of our own frequency. Within the body and outside the body when it becomes more condensed and more higher percentage of uniquely you and your spirit, I mean, the world of possibilities just becomes infinite.

Victoria Volk: So what does that look like? Is it another visualization of almost like this bringing in of, like well, again, myself?

Dr. Amirah Hall: A healthy aura is about arms length around. So it is part of that process, but it’s a process of that I take people through is clearing the chakras as well as clearing the layers of the aura and all so just a continual amount of clearing becoming more aware. Clearing becoming more aware. We become more brighter. Look at our body. When we’re feeling good, We smile at people. We give gifts. We just are more generous and more creative and more flexible and more you know, letting the guy get out of, you know, of the parking lot before you and sit, we’re just more patient than laughing. So I don’t think after we do that, there’s much to do. It’s just enjoying what things light us up.

Victoria Volk: I’m curious if you’re familiar at all with human design.

Dr. Amirah Hall: Somewhat. Yes. I haven’t explored it extensively. I’ve got some friends that have done it. Yeah.

Victoria Volk: I’ve been recently diving a little deep. And I dabbled in the rabbit hole over a year ago, and I’ve recently, I don’t know, timing I suppose and it’s really connecting with me. But what I’m learning though I’m a manifestor energy type for human design. And we have this repelling manifestors have this repelling closed aura and when I first learned about that, it was kinda like, oh, well, people just don’t like me, you know, and the thing is, I don’t see like, I’m within my closed my own aura. I’m within my own closed aura. But it’s not that I’m repelling people. It’s that my energy, either you’re ready to receive it or you’re not, and then there’s something there’s a this energetic exchange. Right? Like, it’s too big or too much for you at this time, but maybe in the future it won’t be. And I’m trying to find how this connects to the energy work that I already do, the energy work that I do, and just really starting to explore that. And I was just curious if you had any insight into that or if that’s.

Dr. Amirah Hall: What I find is I really appreciate your intellect, and I really think it’s a great skill. However, I feel like most of us and I find I get sucked down rabbit holes too, and I like to think I’m intellectual, but I’m not. I don’t know. By the way, meditation, I think, sharpens our intellect, and our sharpen our just ability to know things. They resonate. But I feel like the problem that in the west is that we are over-intellectual. And the problem with energy once you define it and quantum physics has explained this. Right? Mhmm. If you if you define something, it becomes that. So I don’t like to define and say you’re a manifestor. What manifestation to me is everybody is a manifestor, first of all.

Victoria Volk: Oh, yeah. We’re always manifesting.

Dr. Amirah Hall: When somebody locks in a description and says that you’re this, oh, really? I mean, I can prove that different. I can prove that by clearing certain aspects within your space, all of a sudden you redefine yourself, then what? How does their theory or their protocol hold up with that? I don’t believe that we can lock ourselves into an absolute box. I reject those. A repulsive to me because that’s not the nature of energy. As his energetic beings were continually evolving. And so for right now, you might be that. That’s fine. However, if you find that your energy field is repelling people or opportunities or insights or inspiration, then it’s time to shift that, so that it’s not. And that’s all. So I don’t wanna define you that way. Does that make sense to you? Mhmm. Are you a Virgo?

Victoria Volk: I’m a Pisces.

Dr. Amirah Hall: Okay. So then your very nature of Pisces is you’re just swimming in and swimming out and trying to explore and Pisces has a very difficult time with boundaries. They don’t wanna be pinned in. Right? And so I just Yeah I think defining it is actually limiting us. Because I see and know that there’s just such infinite possibilities. I mean, we could really go down some rabbit holes, Victoria. But, I mean, imagine if that was just one dimension and one aspects to you and then other lives, you’re completely different. So how about if we merge all of those aspects together and be the most resourceful, integrated, aligned, present, incredible, abundant, beautiful soul in the present.

Victoria Volk: That’s what I’m working on.

Dr. Amirah Hall: That’s awesome. That’s really awesome. But it’s not in your head. This is the mistake that everybody makes. This is not in your head. The work does not occur there.

Victoria Volk: Oh, absolutely. I totally agree. I actually had a client be like after she worked with me through her grief stuff, in the grief work that I do, she was like people always say, you have to do the work. You have to do the work. And she was like, what’s the work?
She’s like, now I know what the work is.

Dr. Amirah Hall: Yeah.

Victoria Volk: It’s the real

Dr. Amirah Hall: You’re in the crowd.

Victoria Volk: Difficult stuff. Yeah.

Dr. Amirah Hall: Well, it doesn’t have to be difficult.

Victoria Volk: That’s the but the most difficult times in your life, like really looking at them.

Dr. Amirah Hall: Well, and there’s a difference between looking at them or going to talk therapy and you talk till your face is blue about something. I don’t like that. I like honestly, I’m a quick down and dirty kind of girl. I like, you know, give it to me bottom line. Give it to me simple. And let’s get the results fast. That’s kinda how I operate. And that’s why I created these tools that I use is because they do the job. Now let’s get on to having the good stuff. You know? It’s like, hurry up. I don’t wanna I don’t wanna keep living it. I don’t wanna keep rehearsing it. Because the more we talk about it, the more we anchor it, and we’re just connecting with a memory from a plastic experience that’s got an emotional charge to it.

Dr. Amirah Hall: So what if we could just have a magic wand or a stick a dynamite blow that crap up? And then start living the space that we really are. And honestly, I think that’s the biggest adjustment is when we start realizing all the baggage that we’re hauling around isn’t us. We’ve identified with it, but it’s not really who you are. Who who? Now we’re on to it.

Victoria Volk: Well, and then we take on the emotions and then that adjusts our behavior and then those behaviors. Yeah. The heat and then it’s just more grief and more

Dr. Amirah Hall: Well, that’s just how I am and this is who I am, so you have to accept me. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. None of that is true. It’s all a lie. And so, some people are probably rolling their eyes right now and some people are going, I get it. And so we get to we are creating our destiny. We are creating in this moment your present time energy field, whatever it’s consisting I’m holding on to known and unknown that’s conscious and unconscious beliefs and memories and experiences. All of that is creating your future.

Dr. Amirah Hall: So if we create a simple way to start releasing what you are not, because you’re just memories, you will still have the thought of an experience sometimes. Sometimes even some of the memories kind of fade away. And then you have more freedom, more energetic space to focus on what you do want to create. That’s what’s coming into the work. That’s becoming conscious creators, which I believe humanity is being primed for. When we talk about waking up, that’s coming to the awakening moment that we are creating our reality.

Victoria Volk: So what do you see coming up for all of us as a collective in the next year?

Dr. Amirah Hall: So that’s interesting that you would say that. I tuned into a couple guys on YouTube and, honestly, recently, I haven’t tuned into anybody because I don’t want to hear. There’s a lot of doom and gloom. Okay? And I do believe there’s I think there’s a lot of people that wanna suffer. And there’s a lot of people that wanna create more scarcity. I’m on the other end of the spectrum and you can call me idealistic or pollyanna or whatever you want. But, hey, when the economy went to shit in California the worldwide. Right? California was so depressed. And people were losing their houses and their jobs, and I just couldn’t take it. I bailed and I went to Dubai for five years. Now, I say, bailed. Listen. I sold my house. I sold everything and put what was left in a five by five foot storage unit. I went with one way ticket. I didn’t even research Dubai because it was well, it was in twenty ten, but I didn’t research it. I knew one person, and I ended up working with members of the royal family. I ended up working in five-star spas because I didn’t know anybody so I needed to make and build a following. And, honestly, there were times that I would crawl, you know, curl up in a ball and cry at night thinking I was an absolute fool. Because I didn’t know where my next client was gonna come from. And I depended completely on the work I do.

Dr. Amirah Hall: Yes, I was afraid at times. But I also knew that was my point where I needed to be, and it turned out incredible. I learned so much. I explored so much. It was in a grand adventure. I learned so much from the Muslim people and their true beliefs and religion. Know they believe in this energy work. They talk about the gin, these unseen beings in their in their religion. They don’t talk openly too much about it because they don’t wanna call them up or conjure them in. Right? And so I just look, you know, I just have an adventurous part to my spirit. So for me to be around that culture and just to let go and be around incredible wealth, to just drink it, just like going to the forest. Right? You feel and plug into the trees. That’s what Dubai was for me is plugging into that. So when I look at scarcity versus sufficiency, I remember that, right, experience. I’ve just threw myself out there. I put every part of myself out there. And I more than survived. I thrived.

Victoria Volk: It’s interesting. Oh, I’m sorry.

Dr. Amirah Hall: Go ahead.

Victoria Volk: Yeah. It’s interesting you bring that up too because this human design rabbit hole I’ve been going down the aspect of environment really is an important piece of it because when you aren’t aligned with the environment that is conducive to you thriving, you can struggle. And so Yeah. Our environment plays a huge role. I mean, if we’re surrounded by stuff and just piles and junk and I mean, what does that I mean, I’ve always believed that the quarters, you know, it’s a reflection of what’s going on internally. I’ve always believed that, you know, change your environment

Dr. Amirah Hall: Yep.

Victoria Volk: Change your environment, things like that

Dr. Amirah Hall: And change the people you hang out with.

Victoria Volk: That includes the people that you surround yourself with.

Dr. Amirah Hall: If you can’t change the people you’re with, then change the people you’re with. You know, certain resistances that people have, and they’re just not good for us as we grow and thrive. And there’s a lot of people that don’t wanna see somebody thrive. They’re more comfortable being in lack. And then they compare, I came from a family like that. They didn’t celebrate wins. They didn’t cheer me on. They’d rather drag me down. And there’s sometimes we have friends, sometimes it’s somebody that you thought was your best friend, but you start to wake up to the fact that they don’t really celebrate the things you do, then it’s time to find new friends. And the other thing is once we step into coming into our alignment, our true divine design, then we attract people that really effortlessly and very quickly to support us, get a giving us our answers or a new direction.

Dr. Amirah Hall: Dubai was never on my radar. And it was only a client that I had worked with in her life completely changed. She was a doctor in Chicago and everything completely radically changed and she went back to where she was born and which was Dubai. She said, the mirror you need to come to Dubai. And I said, why? Great. Find me somebody to help promote me and I’ll go in. See, I had an open mind. Mhmm. And through caution, I set up some steps that would be reasonable, practical. I went for two weeks. Came back with the two pockets full of cash. And when I love this, say who doesn’t. Right? And so I went, okay. I’m gone with no plan. And I’m a business major. Right? I had a business degree and I knew how to set things up practically, but it it just didn’t work like that for me. And so I think my whole life back to one of your earlier questions that I’ve been trusting my intuition, but it wasn’t validated. Like, I didn’t have an environment or family that would talk about any of these things. And I didn’t have a family that was risk takers. So but even trusting our intuition, like, I would need to go to the grocery store now for this. I don’t know why I could wait later, but no, I need now. Well, I might run into somebody that or or a situation, or maybe I’ve avoided an accident, or maybe I just picked up something and then somebody drops in and so I had it. So whatever those intuitive managers are, I learned to trust mine. They’ve always been with me. But I did close them down for a good part of my life. And depression, grief, trauma, all of those situations, we’ll shut that down. And all the work I do now is to help people thrive in whatever all capacities of their life and to be aligned with who they truly are because that’s that’s the true abundance. That’s the true gift of a lot. That’s our purpose to know who we are.

Victoria Volk: That’s a fantastic way to end this episode because I, one thousand percent agree, we are on the same mission of that, helping people understand themselves, get to know themselves. And lose all these aspects of ourselves that were put on us. Yeah. Whether through expectations or lack of boundaries as kids or these beliefs and patterns and all of those. So how can people work with you?

Dr. Amirah Hall: They can go to my website amirahhall.com and that’s Amirah A M I R A H and Hall H A L L. And I’ve got some free gifts on the website. You can chat with me and we can talk about your next step. I have a reset program that’s a great place to start. It’s a video training. And I also have a master class that’s available on my website that about energy. It’s called manifestation mastery. And, yeah, so there’s a number of things I’ve got a YouTube channel. I’m out and about. And so

Victoria Volk: Anything exciting new coming up or that you’re

Dr. Amirah Hall: I have a class coming up. It’s called intuitive superpowers. It’s a masterclass that’s coming up. But that’s Wednesday. That’s tomorrow.

Victoria Volk: Oh, shoot.

Dr. Amirah Hall: So that won’t work but goal to get on my newsletter and to get on to my list so that you can keep updated for any upcoming events other than that. Yeah, that’s the most current that I’ve got. I will be launching a six-month training, which is an in-depth development of not only your intuitive abilities, but your abilities to manifest. It involves the shock or healing. It involves the mastery it learn and developing the third eye, developing your corevoyant abilities and all your other spiritual abilities. So it’s a robust and mentoring program of six months. So that will be launched in October. So if you’re interested, reach out to me and we can see if that’s appropriate for you.

Victoria Volk: Awesome. Thank you so much for coming back and for doing this part two with me. I’m glad we got to dig into this the practical things that can help people move forward and anything energy stuff I love I love talking about all of this juicy stuff that really was not an aspect of my life up until maybe four years ago. So I’m still very much a newbie.

Dr. Amirah Hall: Well, congratulations. You’re doing amazing. You’re doing awesome work. And it’s such a delight to witness your you look to me like this beautiful flower that’s blooming right under the sun. It’s lovely.

Victoria Volk: Thank you so much. And thank you for being you and for doing the work that you do.

Dr. Amirah Hall: Thank you.

Victoria Volk: And remember, when you unleash your heart, you unleash your life. Much love.

Ep 156 Phoebe Leona: Where Are They Now? | Magic in the Mess

Phoebe Leona: Where Are They Now? | Magic in the Mess

 

SHOW NOTES SUMMARY:

This week, we catch up with previous Grieving Voices guest Phoebe Leona.

I had received a newsletter from Phoebe providing some updates that, I felt, would be a great episode to talk about the potential/impending loss of something she had built with love, sweat, tears, and probably plenty of finances, too.

Sometimes to grow and evolve, we need to close one door so another may open. Little did I expect that as this episode goes live, I feel we could record a third episode – stay tuned…

Back to this episode; this is for you if you are feeling stuck in a mess and having difficulty feeling the magic of the situation and your experience. As Phoebe shares in this episode: “When it is meant for you, you cannot mess it up.”

Be a fly on the wall of this conversation about growth, hard transitions, finding love again, and perhaps more importantly…finding yourself and the magic while in the mess. Or, as I like to say: the thick of the ick.

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CONNECT WITH VICTORIA: 

 

Victoria Volk: Thank you for tuning in to grieving voices. I’m so happy that you’ve pushed play on this episode. And today is a where are they now episode. And I’m following up with my previous guest Phoebe Leona, where we originally had our episode. The first episode were recorded, went live on March twenty-ninth twenty twenty-two. It’s episode ninety two. And it’s titled, I’m only grieving Fridays. And it was all about her experience of losing her father and how that was the catalyst for all of the change that she described in that episode. And now we’re back for Phoebe 3.0 because there’s been a lot of change in transition and a new evolution to Phoebe’s life that I came across because of her newsletter. If you don’t know, when people become guests on my podcast, I often tried to keep up with them and whether that’s on social media or their newsletter or I think a lot of my guests become friends. And so And I’ve always been the person that, like, loves to, where are they now? Right? Like, the eighties pop stars of the one-hit wonders. I’ve always looking up, like, wonder what happened to them, you know. So today is the I wonder what happened with Phoebe. So here she is ladies and gentlemen. TV, what brings you to the podcast? Actually, I asked you to come back on the podcast. So let’s get that great. But I would love to have you share with me what has transpired since we last recorded.

Phoebe Leona: Oh, yeah. Well, first of all, thank you so much for inviting me back, Victoria. It’s such a joy to be with you, and I was before we press record, we were thinking about when was it that we sat together. And I think also, since then, you came on my podcast, so that’s where I was getting my dates confused. Where are they now? Where is Phoebe Leona now? Before, I think you said March twenty twenty-two. So my book did come out. We did talk a bit about that and how is about to be burzed out into the world. So the book was launched April fourth, twenty twenty two. So it’s been officially out for more than a year now. And it’s my little baby. It’s out in the world doing its thing. I did a bit of a book tour. It was on many podcasts. I also created this live experience called the rating experience where I brought together because when I and I don’t know if I talked about this that day, but when I was called to write the book, I knew it wasn’t just going to be a book, I knew it was something that was multidimensional.

Phoebe Leona: So with the medium of having dance being a primary part of my life and also was part of the book too because I talk about how dance really saved me and was a huge healing modality for me as I was going through all of the trauma and all of the grief throughout my childhood and my adulthood when I was dealing with the loss of my father and my divorce. So I wanted to bring that element to life. So I created this thing called Radian Experience, where it was a book reading essentially, but I was also dancing and I also had a friend who’s palette who brought some of the letters that I write to the emotions. She wrote she read them. Out as a poem as I danced, and we had a painter painting live behind me on a beautiful canvas and a sound healer. Creating a soundscape for everybody to be in that space with me those moments of my childhood, those moments of grief, and my adulthood. So that was a really powerful experience and we’re playing around with what more we can do with that. What else has happened with dear radiant one, my little baby, was nominated for best spiritual memoir by own times. Just recently, which I’m very excited about. Yeah. Very excited about.

Phoebe Leona: Thank you. And like I said, I’m just letting it do its thing. And I did talk a bit about my company, NoMad, which was birth from all of that grief of twenty thirteen when I went through everything. I always let NoMad guide me and I follow the breadcrumbs to where what it wanted to do next. And that’s how I feel with all of my creations, including Dear Radian one of, okay, I gave birth it. I put up my heart and soul into it. And now what does it want to become now that it’s out into this world? So I’m sure there’s going to be maybe another 4.0 version.

Victoria Volk: Guaranteed.

Phoebe Leona: That I have no idea. I have absolutely no idea what that will look like, but I’m that’s why I love what I do because I just lean into that mystery of what it wants to it’s a true co-creation. And I love having that space and that deep trust for the creation to just whisper to me or maybe shout at me if I’m not really listening. To say, okay, this is what needs to happen now. And yeah.

Victoria Volk: Okay. So because you brought up co creation and I hear a lot of intuitive vibes in what you’re talking about. Can you share with people how you tapped into that personally and any advice that you would give to others to who may not be getting the message. And then what is that not getting the message play out like in real life. Right?

Phoebe Leona: Oh, I’m getting massive chills in my body. So this is a very good question, and I think we could dig deep into this. So intuition, everybody’s born with us, this idea of intuition. We have these clear abilities. And clairvoyance is one that I think a lot of people know to be, you know, the mediums or the psychics and they have visions. And we don’t necessarily need to tap into it and identify as a medium or a psychic. But we have these clear abilities, which means that we are able to sense the unseen world and have communication with our souls, desire, our guides, our angels, whatever you wanna identify with. I’m not going to label them for you. You can choose if you align with that or not. But there is some sort of sense. So when you just spoke to me, I got chills in my body. So this is a clearability of clear sentence.

Phoebe Leona: So my physical body is giving me or an emotional body as well was giving me signs like, oh, yes, lean into this. When you do meditations and you and you visualize, right, when somebody guides you through a visualization and you can actually see what your future could look like or where that scenario that person is guiding you to or maybe you just do it on your own. That is you tapping into that clairvoyance. So you can dive in deeper and do some research if this is a new idea too. But when we have these abilities to tapping to the unseen world. This is the tapping on the shoulder. Listen, this might be something here you. This is your yes. This is your no. This is that gut instinct. Right? We have even in our vocabulary of I just knew it in my gut. Right? Or you know

Victoria Volk: Spidey sense.

Phoebe Leona: Spidey sense. Right? We have this nomenclature for it in our worlds. And this is really us tapping into our intuition. Now my personal story with intuition was and I might have spoken about this when we sat down the last time I was super intuitive. I had this ability to sense the energy in my space changing that made me afraid to really use my intuition because what I thought was I was creating the scenarios. So my father being, you know, dealing with his PTSD, he would go into flashbacks, and I would actually sense the energy change when he was triggered. So before he physically acted it out in our worlds, in our reality that we were sharing, I felt it. And so when I felt that energy and then I saw it play out in my physical world, I thought, oh my god, I’m crazy, and this is a curse. So I share that because some people might not have had that dramatic story, but they might have had a conditioning. Right? A lot of times as children, we’re being conditioned to not feel these intuitive spider senses, as you said.

Phoebe Leona: We might feel very emotional because we’re in a situation that is unsafe, but our parents said, oh, that you shouldn’t be acting out right now. You can’t act your fears out or your anxiety out right now, so we had to clamp down on these emotions that are part of our intuition as well as children. So there is that looking at it as possibly that it was a curse or maybe it was just programmed out of you.

Phoebe Leona: And so I think it’s really important to know that it’s not a bad thing if you don’t know how to tap into your intuition. This might just be part of your story. And so if you’re curious to be more intuitive and lean into it, there are ways of getting there. And a lot of the work that I do with the somatic work, if that’s a word that nobody knows out there, it’s really just being in the body, it’s being embodied. Being able to tap into your physical body, the sensations that I said, the emotions that are coming through, not just getting lost in your head because a lot of times in our head. It’s, you know, not really truly in our reality. That’s not really our intuition. The messages that come through intuition are usually down in our heart space. And these messages come through as a very like, whenever I feel them come through, it’s just one word or a short phrase, and it’s usually like a heartbeat or like a metronome, like, yes, yes, you got this, might feel like a mantra to me. It is that gut sense. Right? It is that just you feel it in your body. If it’s all up in your head and it’s, oh, like, the squirrel cut, like, the dog and the squirrel. Like, the dog is just, oh, scroll there. Scroll there. Right? If that’s what your mind is doing or you’re getting on cancer, we’ll have all of these different thoughts. That’s not usually your intuition. Right? That’s you just kind of up there letting,

Victoria Volk: Anxiety.

Phoebe Leona: Anxiety. Yeah. Anxiety.

Victoria Volk: Stress,

Phoebe Leona: Ego, Fear, all of it run the show. So I feel that when we can start to really drop down into just listening not needing to know the answer, and that’s what I think happens a lot is something feels uncomfortable. How do we fix it? Right? Let me look at all the things and let me write out the to do list and let me take a class or look at YouTube or Google it and find, go outside of myself. To find the answer. But when we really can just drop down, take a few breaths, understand again, maybe tap into your clear abilities if you know what they are or work on focusing on how to strengthen those. And listen to what’s coming through, whether it is that visualization or whether it is that feeling in your body or whether it is maybe a sound, maybe there is an audio message that you receive or a sound, like sometimes I have ringing in my ears. So there are a lot of ways to listen to your intuition.

Victoria Volk: Repetitive numbers, signs, those two.

Phoebe Leona: Yeah. Yeah. The Angel numbers I see Angel numbers all the time, like, the seven sevens are always in my world.

Victoria Volk: Actually, I had two podcast episodes, recent ones back to back that were the exact same time. Oh, both episodes. And I’m like, oh my gosh. Did I upload the wrong episode? Yeah.

Phoebe Leona: At the end on that today? Oh,

Victoria Volk: Oh,

Victoria Volk: So how did all of this play into the version of yourself that you’re stepping into now?

Phoene Leona: Yeah.

Victoria Volk: I’ve closed a business. I know I know what that process is like and it’s heart wrenching. Yeah. It’s painfully. It’s a painful awareness because you know how much blood sweat and tears you poured into something.

Phoebe Leona: Yeah.

Victoria Volk: And I’ll just say, from my own perspective, what I’ve come to know is that everything is just a stepping stone.

Phoebe Leona: Yeah.

Victoria Volk: And I didn’t fail in that business. You know, when I closed it, people I know people thought people even asked me, oh, we couldn’t make it or whatever because where I live and what I was charging or what have you and a lot of ego thoughts I had and myself too, but really it was I had to close that door for something else to come in.

Phoebe Leona: Yeah.

Victoria Volk: And I wrote my book, and then I started another business that wasn’t the right business. And I had a one chance off conversation with friend who I was working with, and she’s like, you know, for this one business, for my website. And she’s like, you wrote a book, didn’t you, about grief? I’m like, yeah, why aren’t you helping people in their grief? And I was like, Okay. Captain obvious. Good question. And so it was a question. You know, we can’t see the label from inside the jar, and so that one conversation has landed me talking to you again for a second time. It’s you know, so we have these moments in our lives that are truly transformative. Are what do they call those moments? What do they call it? A moment that changes everything.

Phoebe Leona: Like a pivotal.

Victoria Volk: Like a pivotal

Victoria Volk: Yeah. — pivotal point.

Phoebe Leona: Yeah.

Victoria Volk: So what happened? It’s changed. And how did that come to be?

Phoebe Leona: Yeah. Okay. I feel like I wanna go back again because I didn’t fully answer your other question. So I wanna finish that, which will feed into that. And I also wanna bring other people up to speed because they didn’t talk too much about that part of what shifted for me in terms of nomad. So in terms of the intuition, what you had asked me is, what would it look like if you don’t listen to it? And that leads us into this question really.

Victoria Volk: Right.

Phoebe Leona: It’s basically I like to think of it as this child Right? You’re the mom or the father of a child saying, hey, like, just tapping on your shoulder. Like, hey, I need a little attention here. That’s your intuition going, hey, this might not be the best thing to do or go for it or whatever. And if you’re not listening to it, it gets louder and louder and louder until it’s like full on temper tantrum. So in the external world, that looks like, oh, there’s a challenge. Now we don’t sometimes we go, okay, I’m ready to step into this challenge or I’m going to ignore the challenge. Right? We make our choices there. But if it’s I don’t wanna call it the wrong choice. But if it’s the choice that our intuition is guiding us because it knows. Right? It’s our higher self. It’s our soul. It can see your life from a bird’s eye view, and it kinda comes back down into this reality. And it’s like, oh, that’s a good move. Oh, that’s not a good move. Right? So it’s understanding, learning how to trust it. And so that little child that’s tugging on you is going, go this direction. Go that direction. Right? Because you can see that bird’s eye view. But if you don’t listen to it, yes, more challenges, more obstacles come up, and it turns into that temper tantrum.

Phoebe Leona: So where I am with NoMad, that’s the company that I started because of the year of grief. I wanted to have power back because in that year, January, my father died. March, my husband of fifteen years, said, I wanna end our marriage. That started the domino effect of losing my home, my dog, my physical health was at stake because of all the stress. And then the one thing that was still there that I had was my job that wasn’t filling my soul at all. And it was a choice that I had made because of these other two people that were no longer in my life And so that was the one thing that I said, I wanna have control over this. I want to live in alignment with my soul’s purpose, which was to really create a space for people to have a sense of belonging and purpose. And what are the two things that I did at the time while I hot yoga, that was the modality, and I wanted to travel more. So we started NoMad from this place of wanting to feel empowered in my life again and have these other aspects of myself be, you know, fueled again. So I started a retreat-based business. That’s what NoMad was.

Phoebe Leona: And as I said at the very beginning with Dear Radiant, why don’t I just kind of when I create something, I follow the breadcrumbs. So Nomad has been not just a retreat based business where I taught yoga was the modality, but it’s evolved into another modality that I created, a somatic practice called Movement one o nine, that was one of the bread crumbs. It turned into local community events where we had two hundred people at the summer solstice bring coming together in my Hudson Valley community here in New York, it turned into me leading yoga teacher trainings. It also turned into having to go online when we’ve all went into lockdown and figuring that part of the world out. So it evbed and flowed and morphed and shape-shifted in so many different ways. And I just leaned in and they said, okay, what do you wanna do now, baby? Now when I started it, the other aspect that I wanted in that part was I just had this vision that it was going to be with my partner. Like, didn’t have a partner. But I said, if you build it, he will come.

Phoebe Leona: And he did it. I mean, I had a couple of relationships that it could have potentially turned into that, but they all fell apart. Because I was still going through my own grief am I, you know, recovering from my trauma. So a lot of those relationships as beautiful as they were, they triggered a lot, and they got me to evolve further by leaving them and then doing the inner work.

Phoebe Leona: So here I am almost ten years, I guess it’s we’ll be celebrating nine years this year of NoMad, still no partner, letting it kind of morph into things, but I’ve also taken all these other branches, like Movement one o nine, like my book, Dear Radiant One, which can fit under the umbrella of NoMad, but I was noticing that my community was under the umbrella of just NoMad was getting smaller and smaller. And I just could’ve, like, you know, like, square peg triangle or whatever that scene is, a square peg, round hole, whatever. I was just like, oh, no. Just oh, this is all, NoMad. But now I think that there’s something within what I’ve created there and I don’t quite know what it is yet. I don’t know if it’s a book.
I don’t know if it’s Movement one o nine. It might be a combination of both. It might be something completely new. I said in the I think I said in the email that you read. I’m sort of mushy. I’m in the chrysalis. So I’m just letting it morph into what it wants to become right now. But I am also grieving. Right? Here we are talking about our grieving hearts. I’m grieving because it is my baby. I put my hot blood, sweat, love, heart, soul, tears into it. And I’m kind of like, was that a waste of time? And it isn’t. Yeah. Absolutely not. And I really resonate with what you were saying about other people saying, you didn’t make it or you failed. And I don’t feel that. I feel I feel frustrated because I want Nomad to I want I see no I always see my creations as little babies. I’m like, I want my baby to see this world and really be the vision that we had together. So I’m letting go of that idea of NoMad might not get to do the things that we had envisioned together. So yeah. I’m hearing I’m getting a little teary. I didn’t show up. But I do have a deep sense of trust that something else is being born, and I just I have absolutely no idea what it is. And I have a feeling just sitting here talking to you right now, Victoria, that magic is happening.

Victoria Volk: I got full body goosebumps like I if you could see my chicken zips right now.

Phoebe Leona: You’re chicken. I love it. Yeah. I mean, it might just be and I invite this for anybody out there listening. It might just be that you would you just spark something within me hearing your words. That an idea will come out whether it’s just I walk away from that and go, oh, actually, there’s some insight that I hadn’t seen yet. You’re a mirror for me. It might be that you and I are gonna get off of this and go, oh, wait, what about this and this and this and we collaborate or you connect me with somebody or there might be somebody listening here and go don’t let Nomad, go to bed. I love what you’re doing. Did they reach out to me or somebody else, you know, is inspired by our conversation and they go make a big life shift? Right? It doesn’t have to be related directly to me. It might be that somebody out there listening is going, oh, I’m going to listen to my intuition and yes, I need to leave that romantic relationship or that job or maybe it’s time for me to take the leap and make that new step into what I most desire. So who knows what universe is doing right now as you and I are speaking.

Victori Volk: We’re cocreating magic.

Phoebe Leona: Yeah. We’re cocreating magic right now, and the magic happens within the grief. Mhmm. It has to,

Victoria Volk: and I think because of it.

Phoebe Leona: Yeah. Yeah. I just got chills again.

Victoria Volk: Let’s just talk this out then.

Phoebe Leona: Yeah.

Victoria Volk: So what was the dream or is the dream that you had for so long? When you started NoMad?

Phoebe Leona: It was it was providing a space for people who were making transitions in their life. Because I had just gone through and was still going through it. Right? That year of grief, that year of great loss, that year of stepping into the unknown. And as I was doing it, a lot of people were applauding me saying, wow, you made a huge leap.

Phoebe Leona: And I didn’t see it as that. I saw it as, wow, I just got jot down. And I’m taking this one little thing where I might have some power and I was claiming it back. And I didn’t see myself as any sort of hero and that I was just trying to survive, but people were applauding me in that sense of wow, I wish I could do something like that. And I thought, you can, why not? You know, it came sick in nature to me, but I also know that that came from a lot of, you know, I know you had a similar childhood like having to deal with so much chaos. Chaos. Exactly that you don’t know that you didn’t know you don’t realize you had a choice. Right? It’s just like, yeah. This is just what my phase. You just keep going and roll with the punches. So when I started to see that something that came somewhat second nature to me doesn’t come for other people, I thought, well, what if I provide a space what if I take them out of their ordinary life, bring them to a retreats, yes, they get to see somewhere beautiful and you know, have beautiful food and make connections and see parts of the world that maybe they never had seen before, but also see parts of themselves that they had never seen before and tap into this new not a new version I shouldn’t say that, but this version of themselves that they hadn’t really tapped into in this reality or maybe this time and space. Right? Maybe they knew that was a part of them and they lost it along the way. But tap back into that and say you do have the power. If you’re in a toxic relationship, you have the power to leave it. If you are not living in alignment with your soul’s purse purpose. You can leave the job or you can make a big move, you know, physically across the world or whatever it is. It might also be really small and subtle but it changes your whole internal landscape. So that was the vision. And like I said, when you and I say this a lot of my teaching when you know your why, when you’re so aligned with your purpose. The Whats? Doesn’t matter. So, yeah, use the what of the retreats, but the “why” that creating space for people to have that greater sense of belonging so that they could make those transitions in their life was my why and has it has been my heartbeat these whole years since then. And so, yeah, the what is wants to be something new right now, and don’t know what that is.

Victoria Volk: You missed a question though.

Phoebe Leona: How how how how in terms of what how what

Victoria Volk: How do you envision it looking?

Phoebe Leona: Well, I think that’s where maybe that’s a good thing or maybe it’s a bad thing. I don’t have, like, specific visions of how I want it to look. I envision it as this is why I’m showing up in the world. And I trust that universal provide the how and the what. And maybe that is my downfall. And maybe you’re giving me some insight as to get clear focus, baby?

Victoria Volk: Because this is the thing. It’s like we’re always co-creating or always manifesting, but the universe doesn’t know what to manifest or co-create or bring to you. Yes. You’re not clear on the how.

Phoebe Leona: Yeah. Yeah. Story of my life, I think, Victoria.

Victoria Volk: Well, here’s the thing. So, like, I mean, I’m not intending to turn this into, like, some sort of, like, coaching session or anything.

Phoebe Leona: No. I love I get pre therapy today?

Victoria Volk: Here’s the things. When I think of you and when I think about everything that you’ve talked about and shared with me, in the audience, I feel like you’re a very grounding presence for people. Right? So, like, when people are around you and you have these retreats, feel like you are very grounding for them.

Phoebe Leona: Yeah.

Victoria Volk: But Phoebe grounded, how do you fly? Who encourages you and who is the person or what is it, what elements in your life are not, some people need accountability Some people just need a cheerleader. Some people need someone to challenge them. So I think so often too, like, especially helpers they have a hard time asking for help. Mhmm. And so am I am I nailing

Phoebe Leona: Oh, for sure.

Phoebe Leona: Oh, yeah. We got this. Yeah. And I mean, I know you want there was an aspect that you and I talked before, we press record that we’re gonna go to right now is this idea of love in my life. And That has been a huge game changer for me because, yes, going through so much chaos in my childhood alone, I did not know how to ask for help. And going through it again in twenty thirteen, it was the universe going, you need to ask for help Phoebe. And I did. I had to lean in to my family. I had to lean in to some people even strangers because I went to live in Costa Rica for a period of time and didn’t fluently speak Spanish, so I had to rely on strangers to help me. So it’s been a lesson the last nine years of ass asking for help, but still what you just saw, what you just reflected back of the ground in this, that was me going, I need to survive. I need to be really grounded here and not only because I’m a helper, like you said, and on hold space for other people, but I need to provide that for myself. And it was a little bit of survival mode. Right? Or a lot of survival mode. It was just holding on for dear life of okay. Gotta get my shit together.

Victoria Volk: Sols. Can I ask you? Yeah. They don’t mean to interject, but I just because so, like, it feels like because I know for me too, like, I had this grip or this hold. Right? On something, like, this is my identity. Right? Like, this is my identity. This is who I am. This is, you know, what who am I without this?

Phoebe Leona: Yes.

Victoria Volk: Do you feel like the only way to find out if that is where you want to continue to go as if just letting it go, like, backing away for a time.

Phoebe Leona: Yeah. I’m I think I’m in that, that’s why I’m in the chrysalis because it’s the that’s that mushy part. Right? When you’re in the crystal, well, from the little caterpillars in the chrysalis. Maybe we’re in the chrysalis too right now, who knows? But when we’re physically in that idea of the chrysalis, you become mushy. Right? You so you have to have that deep surrender, but at some point, right, when it’s making that shift to become the butterfly, there is the resistance. Mhmm. Like, it has to press out to create the wings. So there is this play between the deep surrender and that resistance of becoming the something new. And that’s really where I’m at right now of letting go of that identity. No man was my identity. For, you know, almost nine years now. And it is letting that go but there’s a there has to be a bit of resistance of like, okay. Well, how do you wanna see the next vision, right, and create that? And so that is, I’m not taking it as a cop out, but I am they I’m figuring out what the how is

Victoria Volk: The “How” that’s where we came back to is the “how”.

Phoebe Leona: Is the how because I’m kind of like, well, I was this for, you know, nine years. That’s all I knew to a certain extent because I was so had the death grip. Like, of Nomad and even though it’s letting it up and flow, but there was this has to survive because it was me proving to the world that I can do this I survived that horrible year and look what came from it, and I’m gonna use it. And you universe is telling me, like, you’re good. You’re so alive. You got this. You don’t have to just be in survival note mode now. You can actually thrive and spread your wings and fly. But I’m not quite there yet because I’m thinking, well, what is that gonna look like? And I guess maybe I’ll find out because the butterfly is not looking, maybe it is, and the, like, wings, like, oh, look at those colors. I’m not sure. Bright and then it just flies and it’s like, oh, okay. I’m crying. So I’m in that exploring process and there’s a little bit of playing with ideas, but also not being attached to them right now and seeing what what comes out of it. But I do wanna answer a little bit more, go a little deeper into this idea of the partner because I did have this vision of my partner is going to come in. But I had somewhat rules and regulation of what he was going to look like and be like because he was going to play a large role in my business, in my vision of them. And it’s really interesting because I’ve been completely single for six years now. Here I am doing my thing. I’m writing a book. I’m doing no mood or a pandemic. I’m still standing. And there were just all these challenges that came. Right? Everybody, I’m not saying I’m not doing a woe’s knee. Everybody has been gone through letting go of the old normal, right, going into that lockdown. There was a deep sense of grief during that period and letting go of your old identities, get letting go of old relationships, jobs, whatever. So I was in that at that time too and trying to figure out what NoMad wanted to be. And like I said, though, that was really when I was doing the square peg round hole and figuring out, well, let’s try to do online. You know, programs or membership or, you know, one on ones. And I was just, like, figuring out what it wasn’t. It just didn’t translate in the way of really being in person with people. And so, you know, the finances were not coming in, I was not receiving the abundance that made it not only thriving but not sustainable. I invested a lot in my book. You know, I did a hybrid publishing, which I am grateful for. I have really love the team of Grace Point, but it was a huge investment that I probably didn’t have, but I just going, it’s gonna pay off. It’s gonna pay off. And because I believe in myself and I even this morning, I was crying about that, my eyes are probably still a little puffy. And here I am about the the brink of letting go of my business and possibly declaring bankruptcy from putting my heart and soul in finances into it and steps in literally out of nowhere this man who just I met him and he’s my person. Like, there’s no doubt about it. And it’s it’s really quite beautiful how it happened because it somebody matched us up who I’ve known for twenty years and she’s known him his entire life since she was five years old. And just out of the blue said, hey, you two should meet. And it’s really quite beautiful.

Phoebe Leona: So I think that I did manifest the how of Nomad, but it also wants to become something completely new and different. And so maybe he’s stepping in because he does have a lot of similarities in terms of strengths that I don’t have that could really be a beautiful combination of what I envisioned originally. He even came to me with this vision that I didn’t put into his head. He said, I think we should do retreats together down the line. We need to do this. So it might turn into Nomad 2.0 after we reestablish our personal relationship and build that business or it might be that we need to co-create something completely new together. I’m not sure yet. And this is the first time I’m, like, publicly talking about this.

Victoria Volk: Well, I got my chicken zits again when you were talking about it. So it feels like truth to me.

Phoebe Leona: Yeah. Yeah. It’s kind of wild. So

Victoria Volk: Is that crazy? I mean, just sit just for a moment. Like, just I mean, we don’t do this enough. Like, just really reflect back. Like, life is crazy. Like, you just cannot anticipate the amazingness that can happen. Right? We don’t It’s like you will you think when you’re in the thick of the icky? The thick of the neck. And you’re in the thick of the neck. You can’t even fathom that there can be brighter days ahead. Yeah. You know, I had a client, one of my first clients, actually, after they became certified as a grief specialist, his life has just exploded. I worked with him for a time. He went through grief recovery with me and stuff. And, you know, at the time, like, his he was struggling in relationships and trying to get his business going and he’s a designer. He does — Mhmm.

Victoria Volk: Now he’s into purses. He designs purses. Ended up on the red carpet. He’s, like, on the own network, the Detroit oh, love in Detroit or something like that? Remember the show. It’s a reality show. Like, it’s just crazy. How his life has just exploded. And he said in a post, he said something to the effect of, imagine living each day. You think today is the best day. But imagine if even tomorrow is better. Like, you have no idea. Yeah. Like live like tomorrow is gonna be even better.

Phoebe Leona: I love that. I’m I think this episode is called full-bodied chills.

Victoria Volk: Oh, yeah. That’s good.

Phoebe Leona: Because I just kept getting chills as you’re speaking about this.

Victoria Volk: Okay. Well, there is a true crime podcast called Full Body Chills.

Phoebe Leona: Okay.

Phoebe Leona: You might have to call you know what? Yeah.

Phoebe Leona: Play around with that because you and I just keep balancing our what did you call chicken zips? Chicken zips.

Victoria Volk Yeah. Chicken zips of truth.

Phoebe Leona: Oh, sure.

Victoria Volk: People would be like, chicken zips of truth. Why? I gotta listen to that one. Yeah. Maybe that’s a go.

Phoebe Leona: There we go. That’ll stop them in their tracks.

Victoria Volk: So what I hear is that you are very curious and excited about not knowing what’s to come in a way. Yeah. And yet surrendering to the how and just letting it unfold. But yet, at the same time, this is where I think, you know, you are a very grown in presence and maybe this gentleman that it’s come into your life, like who’s kind of been under your nose. Right? Like, because he was with the he was he’s a friend of a friend. Mhmm. Had you met him before?

Phoebe Leona: No. Never lived with me. We have so she was a Pilates client of mine here twenty years ago, and I knew her socially too. She even came to my wedding. So I had been to a couple of her parties, and so we have looked back and said, were you at that party? Were you at the upper end? We don’t quite know yet because of this so long ago. But, yes, very much under under each other’s nose. But we weren’t ready yet. And that’s something that I wanna speak into too is

Victoria Volk: Yes. Please.

Phoebe Leona: When when you are ready, the universe makes it so clear and says, get this is it. This is you’re ready now. Right? Here you go. Like, your client. Your client had to go through all of that grief and he was trying, he was showing up and doing his work. Like, ugh. And then all of a sudden, it just clicked. And now his purses on red carpets. And I swear I truly believe in that. And I’ve I have seen that in my own personal life. I’ve seen that evidence in the external world and everybody else in other people’s lives that when it’s meant to be for you, you cannot mess it up. It is just there. And that’s how I felt for this relationship. It was just we were not ready for each other and we’ve had many conversations because he’s done a lot of work on himself if he’s done, you know, he’s a life coaches while he wrote a book too. And it’s even funny when we see that our books, our covers, our same coloring, like, same kind of branding, very similar format. He shares a lot of his own childhood trauma and, yeah, maybe a guest for you, by the way. But yeah.

Phoebe Leona: So it’s just so funny because we’re laughing at each other. Like, we’ve been walking side by side but just weren’t we weren’t ready for each other yet. We weren’t ready for the relationship that we both want wanted for so many years, but we weren’t emotionally ready for it yet. We had to recover through the trauma to a certain extent and our own grief so that we could be ready. Right? He if I had met him six years ago when I had my last relationship, he would have been triggering all my traumas right and left, and I would have said goodbye, just like I did to the other two, man. And so I had to do this in our work for it to show up. And I say that because it doesn’t have to be a romantic relationship. It’s whatever you desire right now. It will show up when you have to do the work, though. That kinda like, it’s that balance of the doing and the being. Right? Because I think that in our world, we get too much in one direction. It’s the very western world of just do do do and have the strategy and check the things off the list. And, yeah, if you hustle and hustle, I played that game for so long and so many things didn’t happen in that world for me because I wasn’t allowing there that to be that surrender into that being. But on the flip side of that, if we’re just, you know, love attraction, I believe in it. I truly believe in it. But if you just do that and kinda lean back and not do any of the work, the thing isn’t really going to be truly yours. I mean, you might see it but if you’re not actually showing up and doing the inner work, going through your grief, going through recovering from your trauma, whatever it is that’s your karma and your dharma. Right? Karma is the lessons we enter into this world and the dharma as you shifted into your purpose. If you’re not actually playing with those two, yeah, those things might come on your radar and you might not see really truly see them or they might just float on by because they’re not you’re not aligned with them yet. So it is that play of the doing and the being?

Victoria Volk: You said something, and I’m gonna say, I’m I had a client, she asked me, Everyone else says you have to do the work. I’d get so annoyed when I’d hear that. Do the work. You gotta do the work. Well, what’s the work? And after she went through a group recovery with me, she’s like, I get it now. This is the work. Like, this is the work. So in your mind, what is the work?

Phoebe Leona: That’s a good question. For me, it’s awareness. I really truly believe awareness is the transformation. Now awareness can look different for people. So awareness might be that you need to be aware of your three d reality? Like, what is actually physically happening in your relationship? Or what is happening in your bank account? Or what is happening in this toxic situation at your job? Right? But also, it’s awareness of what’s happening in your mind, what’s happening in your physical body. How can you listen again to the spidey sense. Right? When you’re in those external relationships with the world and your body’s going, uh-uh, right, you have to bring your awareness to that so that you tap into that intuition. That’s really what I see the work is just being able to listen So it’s kind of funny that to do the work is actually sitting back and listening. That’s step one is that listening and the awareness, but then there is the, okay, now I need to take action from that place. Right? So maybe I do need to get a job that’s going to help you pay the bills or maybe I do need to leave that relationship or maybe we need to go see a relationship therapist. Or whatever it is, it’s actually taking the action and doing the work physically doing the work. And then there is the surrender., of okay, letting go and saying this isn’t working or I deeply trust that it is working, but I don’t see that. Evidence yet. Right? So that’s level three, step three of the work. I’m sure there are others, but those are the three that I feel are necessary in everything as I just talking off the cuff.

Victoria Volk: I love it.

Phoebe Leona: Yeah.

Victoria Volk: I love it. I love this conversation. And I wanna give you an opportunity. To share anything else that you would like to share?

Phoebe Leona: Let me think. I feel we should yeah. Let’s talk a little bit more about grief because that is your podcast. Mhmm. And to know if somebody is out there right now who is grieving a relationship or grieving possibly the loss of their own business or whoever they are right now to allow yourself to simply be in that chrysalis. Allow yourself to get mushy. Allow yourself to I love what you at you pressed me to do is imagine the how or the what or the whatever it is that drives you. Right? It could be the how, it could be the why, it could be the what. But whatever it is that’s gonna just be your heartbeat for a little while. Right? If you’re in that grief space and you don’t know what is to come, find some sort of heartbeat for you that’s gonna get you up every morning and really build a relationship with physical support in your life Right? It might be one person, it might be a community, but then also what has really been a huge piece for me is trusting the divine, the universe, God, guides, angels. Whatever it is that you resonate with whatever word resonates with you and energy that resonates with you in that end unseen world because there is and energy. There are many energies around us that we don’t see and maybe not feel, but they are here and they are on our side and they are flying high above us, seeing a bird’s eye view. And I was in a session, if I don’t mind if you don’t mind me sharing really quickly I was in a, like, a call with some a group yesterday, and you probably have heard this. And I feel like, actually, now I’m saying that you might have even spoken about it, but the idea of the two footprints, two sets of footprints talking to God and saying God, why weren’t you there for me? There were times that I only saw one footprint and I was walking in a long loan, and God said that was because I was carrying you.

Victoria Volk: It’s a footprints in the sand. It’s actually

Phoebe Leona: Footprints in the sand. Yeah. And I just wanna remind everybody because that’s something that I needed to remember for myself is when we’re going through those moments of grief. There is someone carrying us even in those deepest darkest moments, in those mushy moments, in those messy moments. There is something here for us and to just deeply trust and find a way to build that relationship to trust again.

Victoria Volk: And someone is caring. Mhmm. And I think that’s what a lot of people forget. It’s like there are people that care you just have to allow yourself to be cared for.

Phoebe Leona: Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. Oh, that’s a hard one for us, helpers.

Victoria Volk: True. Yeah. It is. What a beautiful way to tie up this episode, I think. Where can people find you now if they’d like to reach out to you and connect with you?

Phoebe leona: That is an interesting question, Victoria. I’m not sure where I’m going. Social media, I’ll just say first of all, social media I’m on Instagram it’s my name @phoebeleona.love and Facebook. And then I do have my website, so I would say right now, they could go to phoebeleona.com that’s where you can generally see what I’m physically doing in the world. Then I have my thenomadcollective.org and Movement 109. Those are also websites, but they’re all linked together. Who knows if they’ll be there in a couple of months? Maybe they got, you know, floated away. Maybe they’re coming back in a bigger way. We don’t know yet. But if you find my name Phoebe Leona, you’ll find what’s happening now. And I think that’s a great way to, like, What is that girl doing? Let’s see.

Victoria Volk: We might have a Where are they now? Three. Yeah. Maybe in a year.

Phoebe Leona: Yeah. Yeah. And I just wanna acknowledge you too because, you know, what you just said of being cared for is you did respond to that it was, you know, somewhat desperate email of, like, I don’t know what’s happening guys. Let’s see. And you were one of, you know, a few that responded immediately and I saw that you cared, and I know that you care so deeply for the people that you help. And the listeners that you show up for. So I just I wanna take a moment to acknowledge that. So thank you.

Victoria Volk: Thank you. Sometimes I need that reminder too, and I’m looking at her clothes. Yeah. Yeah. Since this is my labor of love, For sure.

Phoebe Leona: Yeah.

Victoria Volk: But it’s been a great joy. And that’s why I continue doing it. You know, it doesn’t put food on my table, but it fills my heart. It’s my soul food.

Phoebe Leona: Mhmm. Exactly.

Victoria Volk: Yeah. Find your soul food people. Find your soul food.

Phoebe Leona: Yes.

Victoria Volk: Alright. Well, thank you so much for joining me again. On kind of short notice, like, this was like, hey, wanna come back? Yeah. Let’s do it. Alright. I love that.

Phoebe Leona: You know, we had to do it while it was still mushy because, yeah, it wouldn’t have been that exciting if I was. Everything’s fine now. You know, hindsight.

Victoria Volk: I mean, that’s the beautiful thing behind you. Right? But when you’re in the thick of the ick. Right? The thick of the ick. And it’s not it it doesn’t have to be it doesn’t have to be this negative bad energy. Right? That we like, this drudge of it certainly, it doesn’t feel good. Yeah. But with for all the reasons that you said, it’s like lean into the awareness. How is this making me feel? What do I wanna see for myself in the future? What do I want for my life? Yeah. You know, these deeper questions that we are so afraid to ask ourselves Yeah. You know, one of my favorite segments on Saturday Night Live was deep thoughts by Jack Handy.

Phoebe Leona: Oh, yeah.

Victoria Volk: I mean, I was, like, ten, eleven, twelve, you know. Oh, wow. Because I’m aging myself now. This is when Saturday nightlife was, like, really good. But Yeah. But yeah.
Will Ferrell, deep thoughts by Jack Handy.

Phoebe Leona: Was it I don’t think it was Will Ferrell. It was before Will Ferrell’s time. It was because I actually met him in a certain week already. No. It was before Will Farrell.
It was oh my god. I know who it is, but he’s not in my brain right now.

Victoria Volk: I thought it was the same guy that was played Bob Ross.

Phoebe Leona: It was Al Franklin.

Victoria Volk: Oh, yeah. Are you sure?

Phoebe Leona: Now that I said, and I’m afraid I am wrong, but hold on, Okay. We’re good we’re gonna fact-check.

Victoria Volk: I’m you know, I have a saying, like, with my friends. I’m like, I’m gonna get a t-shirt that says, Google that shit.

Phoebe Leona: Yeah. I think it was before Will Ferrell’s time. And I do feel I see his face. And Al Franklin was on Saturday Night Live? Yes.

Victoria Volk: Phil Hartman.

Phoebe Leona: Phil Hartman. What’s? Okay we both we both lost

Victoria Volk: Wait. No. Deep okay. Well, Jack Handy was an actual person. Learn something new today.

Phoebe Leona: That makes sense.

Phoebe Leona: Yeah. Yeah.

Phoebe Leona: So they made affirmations before is, like, a big thing in our world at which I thought those.

Victoria Volk: Okay. It looks like I have to do some writing.

Phoebe Leona: You’re gonna have to fact-check and do a follow-up for the listeners here.

Victoria Volk: I see a connection between Phil Hartman and that’s segment, but I can’t like, I would have to do some reading. Yeah. Anyway, I will find it. Anyway, I digress. Have a beautiful rest of your day, and listeners, thank you for tuning in. And I hope this episode was helpful. And if it was, I hope you share it or leave a review, five stars if you feel so inclined. And remember, when you unleash your heart, you unleash your life, much love.

Ep 155 Dr. Amirah Hall | The Aftermath and Awakening of a Near-Death Experience

Dr. Amirah Hall | The Aftermath and Awakening of a Near-Death Experience

 

SHOW NOTES SUMMARY:

This week’s guest is no stranger to death. By the age of 20, she had attended 20 funerals. As an adult, she buried her father while, at the same time, her marriage was ending and her health was deteriorating. Little did Amirah know at the time that all of that loss would lead her on a path of self-discovery, understanding, and acceptance of the gifts she had been given.

Dr. Amirah Hall had always believed she came from a typical, ordinary, normal family, where love and support were the cornerstones of their interactions. But she didn’t realize she grew up in a dysfunctional family. Dysfunction runs deep in families. However, in the midst of Amirah’s life unraveling, she felt a spiritual pull that set her on a path of seeking and understanding.

Like many of us, we experience death as a child, are around it, and are exposed to it, but most don’t become communicators with the dearly departed. What set the ball rolling for Amirah was a trip to Egypt she felt a calling to take. On that trip, she would be surrounded by people she didn’t know in a foreign land who were on a mission to save her life. She would later understand that she was transported far away from her body and back again.

This is Amirah’s story of her near-death experience.

If you or someone you know is struggling with the darkness of life or has experienced the grief of death and want to find the answers, I encourage you to listen to this inspiring episode.

Subscribe to Grieving Voices to hear a Part 2 conversation with  Dr. Amirah! She will be back for another episode where we will dive deeper into spiritual practices, sharpening our tool of intuition, all things energy + more!

RESOURCES:

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CONNECT WITH VICTORIA: 

 

Victoria Volk: Thank you for tuning in to grieving voices. Today, my guest is Dr. Amirah. She is the founder of Seoul Mystic School, a modern mystery school for psychic development and energy mastery. She’s the author of five books including manifesting miracles one on one and love up your life and was featured in the documentaries to death and back again and angels among us. She’s been practicing psychic medium, spiritual mentorship, and quantum healing after having a life changing near death experience while traveling in Egypt. She’s the past host of lessons from the Light Radio podcast. Thank you so much for joining me today. I’m excited to have this conversation with you.

Dr. Amirah Hall: Thank you. It’s my pleasure. I’m super excited to be here.

Victoria Volk: We were talking a little bit before we started to record, and I had to stop us because there’s so much I wanna get into. But where I usually start interviews with guests is your story and how you’ve become, come to be Dr. Amirah.

Dr. Amirah Hall: Well, thank you. It’s been quite a journey. I’m gonna give you the reader’s digest version. Okay? So don’t even know if reader’s digests around anymore. But I grew up in Canada. I grew up to a in the conservative family. I was raised Catholic. Went to Catholic school for twelve years. I never got in trouble all the way through school. I was an honor student and a hard worker. And I was always very, very sensitive. I had a father that his brother committed suicide. I believe I was eight.

Dr. Amirah Hall: And I’ll never forget that was my first experience of watching or seeing my dad cry. And I remember just standing there just feeling so painful and not being able to help him. My mother was holding him as he was grieving because he found his brother who had shot himself basically in the head.

Dr. Amirah Hall: So then my dad was an alcoholic. I thought I had a normal family, which I guess at the time it was a normal, dysfunctional family. My mom was an enabler and I was one of those people as a young sensitive, I was always trying to keep the peace. And yet, I was so sensitive I would often be said, stop crying. Stop crying. I’ll give you something to cry about. Or why are you crying now? I mean, I would be upset if you know, kid at school played a trick on me and threw a water bomb on me. Well, that any kid would probably be upset with that.

Dr. Amirah Hall: But I was the kid that my mom knew when I walked in that it wasn’t a good day. Right? I was always looking for friends I was always curious. I always found myself going out and building relationships and building friendships. So what happened was I think at least a little of ten, my mother had a brother and sister that died two days apart. Now my aunt was a nun in the Catholic church. And my uncle, well, he was only thirty years old. My aunt was twenty-four. That was pretty significant because it was sudden for my aunt. Well, we knew about a month before my uncle was sudden he was died of cirrhosis of the liver, but he was a non drinker. So it was a a real a moment in time where I remember the chaos and I remember people coming over with with casseroles. And again, I was sort of numb. Like, what is this? I didn’t know what it meant. She went to heaven.

Dr. Amirah Hall: And my and then the nuns or the hot the convent all descended on our home. And it’s funny because they told us that my aunt wasn’t part of our family. So they only informed the family a month before she passed. And so there was a lot of discussion about family being upset with this. Right? We didn’t know. And their comment was she was part of their family. At God’s family, she wasn’t part of our family. So we didn’t need to know.

Dr. Amirah Hall: And so that was pretty significant in terms of me even trying to understand one of the nuns befriended me because I was so sensitive and I was crying. She would write me letters for years. And she was so graceful and peaceful and supportive. She was the first really mentor that I had, that reminded me that I was pretty or this, that I was smart. And so that was my first experience with religion shutting us down. My mom stopped going to church. And by the time I got to high school, I would go with friends to their churches. I was curious.

Dr. Amirah Hall: I remember the first time I thought if I go in that church, I might not come out. I’m like, die. Like, what’s gonna happen? It was so ingrained in me that this was a really bad thing to do, a bad idea. But I went and I lived and so enough about that because that was I think my quest that began for finding out who is God who is Jesus and wanting a connection.

Dr. Amirha Hall: My grandfather died. I was having connections and visions with my aunt but I didn’t know what to do with it. My grandfather passed from the same family, and grandpa gave me a dream before he passed. And then he showed me on the path. We were both walking along. We were holding hands. And grandpa just dropped my hand and he didn’t speak. He spoke to me telepathically. It’s like, I’m going this way. I’m taking this fork in the road. You’re going this way. And I just knew. That his journey on earth was gonna end.

Dr. Amirah Hall: I went camping with some friends that weekend, and we were sitting around the campfire, and I just blurred it out. Am I going to wear to the funeral? They’re like, what funeral? What are you talking about? Got home and my mom met me at the gate and mentioned that my grandfather passed. I knew in the moment. And so that was my, I guess, you could say, curiosity was death that continued to build and I continued to By the time I was twenty, I had been to twenty funerals. And Catholic funerals were not anything I mean, everybody just cried. And so, but I was starting to feel like there was something more. There was something beyond this, and so I held on to that fascination. Until well, no. I guess it was really a pivot point of my dad’s death.

Dr. Amirah Hall: And when I went home, I was living in San Diego at the time and I went home to Canada for my dad’s funeral. And well, he was in the process of making his transition. And it was gruesome. It was painful. And he was in ICU for two weeks. So that was back in nineteen ninety. So you can just imagine we didn’t have Internet, we didn’t really have anything to communicate, but or to understand what was going on. They had hooked them up with life support but it was just pushing his body up and down. The forcing air into the lungs to make it look like he was alive. Meanwhile, his whole body was shrinking. And we were waiting talk about crazy.

Dr. Amirah Hall: We’re waiting for my ants to arrive from Florida. California, respectively. And so the rest of us just kind of suffered watching this. It was just incredibly painful. Like, gold moment just cry and sob and it was torment for me. The doctors kept saying any minute, any minute, now it went on for two weeks. So I empathize with people that with families that send to Alzheimer’s or a long-delayed death and is it feels like torture. So at the same time, I was going through divorce.

Dr. Amirah Hall: I had just started my divorce. In fact, Yeah. It was I don’t wanna go down that road, but it was something that was in process. So after dad’s death, I was at a real low. And I was going home. I was flying back. I picked up this book. I think it was in the Vancouver airport. “Many lives, many masters.” And that was a first glimmer into yes we do go on. Because that my internal question is, what happens when we die? Where do we go? What where what is all this? So it was really driven home with my dad’s death, and it was like my wake-up call.

Dr. Amirah Hall: And by the time I got back to my job, my health was failing. I was not going to work. And back in those days, they could candy for that. So they did. They fired me. So I was going through a divorce, my dad died, and now I have no money and no job. And at the time, I was making a very high six fees. Not six figures. I was high-five figures. And back in the nineties, that was significant. Right? But then nothing and no support from anybody.

Dr. Amirah Hall: So I was in a real talk about dark night of the soul and then having no energy. The doctor told me, yeah, well, you look like you’re dying. You go on or prepare your affairs. You’re either gonna die or you’ll end up in a wheelchair for the rest of your life. Well, that’s not good news for anybody. That’s the worst thing possible that I could have heard at the time.

Dr. Amirah Hall: And so I went home and I to use your word grieve. At the time, I would call that a holy hell. I was just miserable. I was falling apart at the seams from every angle, didn’t know who to talk to. I had no I was new in the states. I was only here about three years by then. And so I didn’t have strong relationships. I didn’t have a good support system.

Dr. Amirah Hall: So when everything hit the fan, after crying for two weeks, and a friend said, you need acupuncture. Try this, Amirah, that’ll help your health. So, God bless her. I had no other options. The doctor threw me to the curb. Right? It was just like, Okay. Well, this is some hope. Let’s try this out. So that’s when I started down the avenue of alternative care.

Dr. Amirah Hall: So again, back in the early nineties, there was it was almost like you were doing back office an abortion or something when you talk about acupuncture, like, mama was the word, no way, oh, that was horrible. But I had no other options. I went in for it. And so that progressed and I got better and a little bit better and a little bit better. And I built some businesses, some entrepreneurial endeavors, and I started working with gemstones and making custom jewelry. I started expanding that to an international market.

Dr. Amirah Hall: So I was doing really, really well. But not making enough money. But my health was restoring and I started feeling and stronger and I felt like there was something missing in my life. Like, I had the money now, business was in my well, I got hired in the tech industry. My health was getting better. The divorce was finished. I had more money coming in and I’m like, fine. Okay. I’m good. But something’s missing.

Dr. Amirah Hall: So I told a friend that I was feeling a sense to go to Egypt. And she gave me a brochure. And I found myself a few months later with soon as I said, well, I’ll go if I get my tax return. And I got to pay for this. Sure enough, it manifested this tax return refund.

Dr. Amirah Hall: And so I go to Egypt, which was an incredible spiritual journey. We meditated in temples. When I landed in Egypt, it was the strangest feeling. I know this sounds weird, but I felt like I was home. And it was a sense of being so familiar yet I had never you know, I didn’t study Egypt. It wasn’t on my bucket list. I wasn’t somebody that was fascinated. I did it maybe science report in school or something, but that was it. Book reporter, what did they call that social studies project? This was an amazing experience of learning about the ancient teachings, learning about the mystery schools, and I gravitated towards that. It just made sense to me.

Dr. Amirah Hall: Well, I met someone there and I extended my stay after the trip was over, went down to Luxor from Cairo, where the tour ended, went down to Luxor, and hung out for a week and I said, I’d really like to get some antiquities for the jewelry that I make. Some beads. Well, this was a very very primitive village right outside the valley of the kings where all the ancient pharaohs twos are buried. And so this little village, people their homes are perched up right at the backside of this mountain where all the tombs are. And so people would be digging through their back wall, so these houses are literally built on the mountain. Right? They’re digging at night and they’re trying to find tools or antiquities or any kind of treasure. So they’re trying to work ahead of the you know, the ministry of antiquities, digging. And so they would have these, Arabic carpets hanging on the back wall cover off the tunnel. So I knew from that that there’s a high likelihood some of these people would have beads. We’re just talking some small beads. Nobody’s gonna notice this ant colony leaving the country. Right? That was my logic.

Dr. Amirah Hall: And so anyway, we found a guy. And he showed me the beads, and I think there was a handful. And he’s one in three hundred bucks, and I didn’t have that much cash at the time. So I went, I said, come back tomorrow with the cash, go to the ATM, come back. Now that was the day I was leaving. So it was about noontime, minus heck. And we go back to pay, we’ll have it his money. And when you visit when you have a transaction like that or your friend, especially I was a special guest because my friend, Jude, who was brought me there. They bring out cocacola or a tea, coffee, water, you sit and visit. You it’s very polite.
It’s not just a slam-bam. Thank you, ma’am. Pay and run. It’s not like that at all.

Dr. Amirah Hall: So here I am, the only female, and they bring out this green garden lawn chair. Right? I’m sitting on this plastic chair. And all of a sudden, they bring out this joint. And Mohammed says, you know, it’s the best. It’s the best. And he’s screaming and I’m coming from this dysfunctional family, I’m feeling agitated myself, and I’ve disturbed the peace, so to speak. He is shouting. And Arabic’s Egyptians are very vocal and loud and expressive. Let’s call it that way. And I said, I don’t smoke. And I had tried a few times. It didn’t really do anything for me. And I just was like, No. No. Thank you. And then the shouting continued. So I’m thinking, oh, god. I’ve insulted the man. I’ve gone against their protocol. And now I’m the only woman here. I should mind, do something here because this could escalate.

Dr. Amirah Hall: So I thought, okay, it’s not done anything for me in the past. Maybe I’ll just acquiesce, be a graceful guest, and I’ll be on my way. Nothing will happen. Right? Okay. Didn’t happen that way. The joint went around twice. And all of a sudden, they have these workers that are chiseling Alibaster outside the factory entrance. And so they all of a sudden showed up in this showroom. And so there’s like eight or ten of us in this room. So one joint goes around, the circle, twice. And everybody bounces up. They’re ready to walk out the door except for me. I can’t get out of the chair. I’m sitting there. Only I find myself standing behind myself and I’m witnessing all the people that are in the room and it’s like they have an individual television and I’m why watching this video play out on their on your screen. And I’m just horrified and I’m like, what the heck is this? I need to stay in my body. I need to get back. I need to come back. And so I thought to myself, I so I was coming and going coming out in and out, it was sort of a subtle phase. I must have said something. I don’t recall hearing myself verbalized, but I definitely had my hands out in front of me. And I just thought I need water. If I could splash my face with this water, I’ll stay here. I won’t leave. I just knew I needed to stay. And so obviously, they’re laughing, and everything’s in slow motion at this time for me.

Dr. Amirah Hall: And my friend Juju must have either sense that I need water or they also were aware that a lot of westerners get dehydrated. So that was a part of the front and center for their awareness. So he comes towards me with the water bottle and he pours water in my hands and I remember getting it right about, you know, six inches from my face thinking, oh, shit, my mascara is gonna run. That was the last spot. And I blacked out.

Dr. Amirah Hall: Now, what they informed me and filled in the points at this point, my body stiffened. And according to my friend, juju, my breathing stopped, my heart stopped, and he was pounding my chest with all his might to get my heart going, call that jokingly, Egyptian CPR. And he was just going to be, beat the drum so to speak. They drag me out under the arms, drag me out into a pickup truck. So the pickup trucks there are the taxis. They’ve got benches along the back of the box, but they stuck me in the cab so my there’s the driver and juju’s in the middle, and I’m on the outer edge. They’ve got my head propped up outside the window. Trying to give me air, some oxygen. And they’re barreling down this dusty, sandy road to nowhere as far as I know. So I’m out of it.

Dr. Amirah Hall: The next thing I remember is coming through the night sky and curling through the sky like I was a comet. And towards a familiar blue ball way off in the distance. And I’m like, oh, that’s where I’m going. And that little ball got bigger and bigger and bigger and it was like so massive. And I’m like, oh, how am I gonna find myself? And then the next thought was, well, I heard this talking language, but I had no clue. And I’m like, I don’t know that language. I don’t know where that is. And then it went, that’s Arabic. I’m in Egypt. There was like a GPS beacon that was just directing me to where my body was. And then it felt like I was trying to put on wet clothes. Have you ever put on wet clothes after going swimming or getting thrown in the lot. It’s miserable. It’s cold and yucky in. It’s just awful. So I felt like I was struggling to get in my body, like putting on my clothes for about twenty minutes. It wasn’t that long, but felt like that. At the same time, the bright light was incredibly painful to my eyes, and it hurt almost to coming into my body. At the same time, I felt this incredible overwhelming bliss and love and peace. And so it was a peculiar experience and Juju stayed with me. Basically, what happened, this then I realized I’m in my body and I’m hearing these voices and I can’t open my eyes and I reach over and I touched his arm. Well, he just law like the dead man coming alive or the mummy or so he was very animated. And I’m thinking, I don’t know what the problem here. Well, I said, where are you taking me? And he blurted out something in Arabic, which then he realized she doesn’t speak Arabic. I have to speak English. So they were highly excited. You know, this was extremely difficult. I said, well, I need a bathroom.

Dr. Amirah Hall: Now, here’s another problem, Victoria. Back in those days, there were no western-sized type toilets in the Valley and the Kings in that primitive village. There were holes in the ground. Okay? And there’s these little porcelain markers where you put your feet. I couldn’t stand, and I didn’t know that. And I didn’t even realize there was something problem with toilets. Okay. So I’m saying, they said, well, we’re taking you to the hospital, and I’m thinking, Oh, shit. A hospital, I mean, primitive country here. That’ll kill me. If I go to some gerund lights in the bone docs, so that was where I was at. I’m like, oh, I just need a toilet, please. I’m fine. And so there was some they can Arabic, and so they finally figured it out, oh, their brother, his brother, had a flat that was europeanized. Okay? And so the facilities were appropriate for a woman. That’s another issue because in that culture back at that time, that a man cannot go into a private space like that with a woman. This is the worst. This is like the worst crime known to man. I mean, they were it would stone a woman probably for doing that openly. So here I am in their flat their apartment. And I won’t let him leave me in the bathroom. They carry me up the stairs. He’s on this edge of this bathtub sitting next to me and his tiers are just streaming down his face. And I’m blissed out. I’m thinking I’m so proper. I’m modestly covered my legs, so nothing’s exposed. And I’m thinking everything’s cool. The sister-in-law’s beaten down the door. She’s frantic because a man and a woman are in the bathroom. She’s thinking they’re having sex. That’s their primitive mindset. That’s time. Well, nothing I could say or do, and I didn’t realize what all was going on. I’m completely blissed. And then he just said, you die. You don’t understand. He said, you died.

Dr. Amirah Hall: So fast forward, I was on the bed. I’m they brought me into the bedroom. I’m laying their recovery. They brought me water and yogurt and an orange. And it was the strangest experience because the orange it was cut orange. They also knew as a westerner, I couldn’t have any other type of food. It needs to be peeled or it needs to be boiled or something like that. So the yogurt was safe. And they suspected I was dehydrated or something was a miss with my electrolytes. Right? Because they’ve seen it. And westerners are just not. Oh, and I failed to mention, I had done a thirty day detox prior to going to Egypt. So I was primed plus I had this two-week spiritual journey prior to that. So I was primed and hypersensitive to all of these types of things. Right? But I was oblivious to it.

Dr. Amirah Hall: So what happens is I start seeing this being, this entity. Her name is Sekhmet. She’s a lion’s face with a female body. She was just a statue to me going through Egypt I didn’t relate to all the Egyptology and all the beams and the deities. It was overwhelming. Right? When you first go and you just okay, it’s a nice story or that’s their religion and it just didn’t resonate, but I’m seeing her in the wood grain of the arm war and I’m thinking I’m losing my mind.

Dr. Amirah Hall: And there’s a window with Nile Valley there and there’s these sheared draperies fluttering inside the room, the wind was or the breeze was coming into the room, and I see the bright blue sky and this brilliant evergreen Nile valley. I’m looking out there. That’s real. I can’t look at this. This is not real. And from that moment on, I have been seeing beings and entities. At first, it felt like I stepped into a scene in the Star Wars movie, the Cantina. You know, or all these strange beings and deities and actually it was overwhelming But so the first part of it, I was still blissing out and denying I was seeing that. I was trying to focus on something that was tangible. And Juju escorted me to Cairo. I got my tour guide was there waiting in line, and I remember I asked girl, who’s that lion goddess with female, you know, body? And she said, oh, that’s Sekhmet. Sekhmet is the healer of healers. She was the patron saint in Egypt. She was known by all the doctors. They would pray to her. Okay. That’s nice information.

Dr. Amirah Hall: I get on the plane, I sleep all the way back to JFK. It’s like an it was an eight-hour flight, but it probably had been fifteen hours to this point by the time I get to JFK. And I get there, I get off the Jet Way, and all the people look like black and white paper dolls. And I’m freaking out. I’m all by myself. And I’m like, this is horrible. I’m horrified what I’m seeing. And I don’t wanna come back here. This place America is horrible. It’s angry. It’s depressed. It’s grief-stricken. It was just it was very low vibration. It’s like literally I stepped off a JetWay into another dimension and I went, and I kept looking at my book. I know it was I realized at one point it was upside down. I couldn’t read it. But I wanted to focus on something that was real and none of that out there was real.

Dr. Amirah Hall: That continued until I got to San Diego. I got off the plane, so it had probably been about a twenty four hour journey, the whole thing. Get off the plane and that moist air hit me, and it was like, Okay, I’m back. And and and and that noise stopped. However, for about nine months, I was stuck in a very deep depression. One, I didn’t wanna be here. Two, I didn’t know what the f happened. I was confused in ninety, so this was in nineteen ninety-eight. There was no internet. There was no resources. There was no.

Dr. Amirah Hall: So I started going to psychics and healers or anybody. I definitely didn’t wanna go see a psychologist because I’m like, they’re gonna lock me up and throw away the key. There is no freaking way I’m going to those people. I know something happened. I am different. However, I haven’t lost my mind. I was that hardworking student. I was that type a personality responsible and honest. And so I went to all these healers and you know what? I got really ticked off because they told me something different every single one because they didn’t know. And then I finally got the message, okay. I gotta figure it out myself. I get it. I get it. Okay.

Dr. Amirah Hall: I found a friend brought me to Mexico. I found this healer. She reads cards, but she wasn’t a healer. She was a card reader. And she’s saying in Spanish to my French I don’t understand the cards. It says she died. This card should be over here in the future of this death card, but it says she died. So we kinda looked at each other, like, yep. Okay. That thanks a lot. That validates something like that happens.

Dr. Amirah Hall: I went back to Egypt the following year and my friend Jude brought me to see a holy man in the far south of Egypt in s one. And he was just a guy that would hang out in the in the market in this little cube, not a kiosk, but they have these little shops, right, with all these shawls or whatever it was. We brought him a very luxurious gift. And I said, what happened? Of course, to do is explain or translating to this holy man. And he said, She didn’t die in in in Arabic, you know, in their mind, their level of understanding. He said, but she went very, very, very far away. So, technically, my body wasn’t buried and I wasn’t, you know, tuned, but I went very, very far away. So that helped me understand.

Dr. Amirah Hall: And then when I came back, I continued asking a friend of mine that was on the trip referred me to another healer. And this healer, he he was looking at my energy, and he said, oh, he said, you’ve got some stuck energy. And I’m like, okay, that’s something to do. I get to undo that stuck energy then. Right? It seemed pretty simple to me. And I did. I began starting to understand the nuances of my energy. And what that all meant. And within about six months, I well, I started feeling happier I started feeling sleeping better. I was more inspired. My creativity was coming back. I wasn’t a bitch on wheels. You know, I because that when though I first came back, I fired all my friends. I stopped all my hobbies. I got fired from my job again because I was just miserable. It wasn’t fun to be around. It wasn’t fun to be anywhere. I wanted to go home. I didn’t want to be here at all.

Dr. Amirah Hall: So I figured I gotta write about this story. So I go to the book expo. And I’m trying to think I can hook up with an agent or a publisher. I didn’t know how this whole thing worked. And only to be rejected. But, you know, people looked at me like, you gotta be crazy. You know, this you were just hallucinating girl. You know, you’re just this is cuckoo crazy. And they give away all these books. And so I’m I guess I was a glutton and I fill these two linen bags with these big heavy, hard bound books. And so I was my back was breaking.

Dr. Amirah Hall: And I said, I need a massage desperately. So I found this Chinese massage place. I go to the massage and this guy’s walking on my back and it hurt like hell. And I had a spontaneous out of body experience. So, those whole year was less than a year, maybe about nine months. I had been asking, where did I go? What happened? I’m different. I’m different. And I’ve been searching. Where did I go? I know I’m different, but what? You know, now what? So that’s when I had this out of body experience and I was transported, teleported, I was greeted by this being. It was almost like my body appeared with this being that was just like an egg-shaped, fuzzy, white energy, a presence. And my body literally melted, and I created this life form, light form, and the guide said to me, I’m gonna take you on a tour of the hall, but you can’t stay. And so there I was escorted into this place. It was this grand, incredible building. I struggled to this day to describe it. It was ultimate perfection and beauty. The precision was beyond anything that Earthwards can describe. And I was merged into a conference room. And my sense is there were twelve people. I didn’t count them, but it felt like there was a board or a committee of twelve. And they were all dressed identical. Very three d like and like suits and proper and formal. And then their heads were glowing And at the top of their head, it was like a lid open, like a teapot. And there was this glowing ball of light that just streamed into my head, right into my third eye, I guess, I could say. And it’s and they said to me, you you can know anything you need to know, whatever you need to know it.

Dr. Amirah Hall: And instantly, I was teleported out of there and I was standing with my guide. It was, like, not visible. There’s a presence with the guide communicating. And there I was standing in front of this corridor that went on for infinity.
And there were doors on either side of the corridor that sat at east my guide said, you can enter any door that you choose. You can’t stay. So I went to the easiest route. I took the first door of my right. It was a gold door. And I stepped through it. It was like I merged through it. And I stepped into what felt like a kaleidoscope of color. And it was moving patterns. And it was incredibly rich, warm, comforting embracing in ways that the only way I can describe it was, like, going back into momma’s room and feeling the love and the support and the safety. And I said, what is this? And the voice said to me, This is the fabric of all creation. This is love. And I was just so immersed into it and so still and so full. And then I was full of gout. And I’m like, I don’t know, rude. I was liking this. I wanted to stay there. And then I went across the corridor. I entered this the store across the way. It was pink. And I merged through that door and it was a solid green Emerald Green Energy. I said, well, what’s this? And they told what I then saw was my life review.

Dr. Amirah Hall: And I saw a timeline of my own life, all the places where my emotions had gotten stuck or interfered with what I was creating or my flow. I could see that I created my I created the dysfunction and the decease in my life with my emotions. And being highly emotional, that’s how I did it. And those emotions weren’t flowing and I was very attached to them and that way of being. I knew in an instant I needed to go home well, at home. I needed to detox. And the detox was not only the physical body, It was mental, emotional, spiritual. And I realized in that moment that that was my purpose. And to understand who I am and that everything was energy. I had stepped into the quantum field. I understood it at a level. That was beyond my words or my vocabulary at the time. I think, finally, when I came across Doopak Chopra, I’m like, oh, I get it. This is where I went. This is what it is. And this is the explanation that and my guide told me that meditation was crucial. For all of it, for all of our disease, all of our dysfunction. And that there is tools to practice, but it was a it was a journey. And so for twenty three years now, I’ve been doing this work. And yes, I still see beings. I connect with loved ones on the other side because they are just changed forms, and I’m able to access that and receive information. I’m also have the ability to heal them. If there are a sense of being stuck. So Victoria, I feel like I’ve just firehosed you here with the story and didn’t take happen. I apologize.

Victoria VolK: That’s okay. And I don’t do you have to go soon?

Dr. Amirah Hall: No. No. I’m good. I just I feel like when it starts coming the stream of information, you know, it’s like I get so excited to get it out and to share that often don’t take a breath myself. So

Victoria Volk: Well, I felt like I was listening to an audiobook. Like, it was just I was envisioning it as you were talking and just felt like I was kind of experiencing it with you in a sense. There was a couple of questions that I thought of on the way as you’re speaking. Can you speak to a little bit what when you were feeling it in your darkest place? Physically when your body was starting to break down, what did that actually look like?
Like, what were you struggling with physically?

Dr. Amirah Hall: I can remember driving to work after my dad died and having to pull over to the side of the road and just overwhelming tears and sobbing. And I had healed my I had already started personal development work, and I had been healing my relationship with my dad. So I thought we were good. And when he died, I was so freaking mad. I was he was a dirty rotten bastard for dying and leaving me. You know, that we just got going in terms of healing what we had. And I just felt so jipped, you know, losing both men in my life and that that were significant and my the divorce and my dad. And, yeah, I’ve become I became completely dysfunctional. Like I said, miserable. I was I was heavy. I was negative. I was so over time, that built up. And then, well, the doctor told me I had chronic fatigue syndrome. So, you know, they don’t know how to diagnose that. They lump that in with everything.

Dr. Amirah Hall: And it’s my belief system that fibromyalgia you name it, you name it. In fact, I can see the beginnings of cancer. In fact, before the show, we were talking about a client that had recently lost one client lost her son to suicide a year ago. Another client her friend wasn’t my client yet. She lost her son seventeen years ago. Now that woman seventeen years is hanging on to that energy of the loss. And her fear of letting that go is that she’ll lose connection with her son and perhaps, you know, be a bad mom as a result of that. You know, you just have to Whereas the other lady who has been healing those energies of loss and pain and just incredible separation, that feeling of separation. She’s thriving.
She’s doing things that she hasn’t done in years. She’s having a great connection with her son now. She can actually feel him come and give her a hug. And so there’s I find the contrast so fascinating, not not as a judgment, but as an as I think as hope or as an as a lesson, as a possibility that there are other ways that we can still have that connection with our I talk to my dad all the time and when I pull out his hunting knife and I’m cutting something, I always feel him coming like, watch your fingers young lady. It’s like every single time he comes in for that. Yeah.

Victoria Volk: I think that’s a great I’m glad this came up because I think people tend to focus on that separation, like you said. Like, the focus is just the separation. Like, I’m never gonna see them again. I’m never gonna speak to them again. Never gonna hug them or touch them or pick up the phone and call them again. It’s that the focus is so much on the separation. That you can’t even fathom the idea that the relationship is continuing. Right? That’s still a relationship that’s continuing, but it’s so unhealthy and dysfunctional and — Right. — and not self-serving at all.

Dr. Amirah Hall: Yeah. And only turning other people too because

Victoria Volk: Exactly —

Dr. Amirah Hall: You’re affecting the entire family or friends and your all your other relationships suffer. So you have to, you know, if we can have a moment and just think in terms of I know when we’re grieving, we’re not thinking of anybody else. We’re really self absorbed. Most of the time, I was. And it was all me and my pain, and I didn’t have the bandwidth for anybody else. But I can honestly say I’ve been divorced over thirty years now. My ex-husband committed suicide in COVID. And I know there’s a growing number of suicides and depression that people are experiencing. And what I’d like to say to that is I couldn’t connect with him for a very long time. And as a medium, as somebody that does talk to the dead, I thought, well, this is interesting.

Dr. Amirah Hall: When a client comes to me, for instance, my client, whose son had committed suicide a year ago, I couldn’t connect with him at first. And what I the first impression I got was his energy let’s call it a package of energy. And he was stuck in an elevator, and he wasn’t going up or down, and it was confined And I could see that there was drug-induced and so there was a question of was it accidental or was it intentional? But I also saw the depression. So, you know, it all sort of came together. It wasn’t it wasn’t a place of blaming one thing. You know what I think is those of us grieving or left behind, we wanna have a reason. We wanna pinpoint what exactly it was that I don’t know as if it’s gonna help ease our pain or maybe your guilt? That we should have known something. So when we connected with him, I’m trying to remember. See, because I’m in a slight trance when I look and connect. So I don’t remember my story’s crystal clear unless we talk about it.

Dr. Amirah Hall: And so my client and I, we’ve talked about it many, many times as it comes up. But So we I I can see the energy where they’re stuck, and I can move the energy. So, like, I understand in religions, they talk about limbo. Or purgatory. Mhmm. And I would say that’s probably the zone. It’s like a zone. Like when I came back from my near death, I think I was stuck in a limbo that was freaking depressing. It was horrible that zone. And so just like when we leave the body, it’s my understanding that we can that can happen also. Now I’ve also connected with loved ones on the other side who committed suicide, who weren’t stuck. Okay? So it’s not a it’s not a blanket statement. It’s not It’s so in my own husband, I did some clearing and I did all the work and connect tried to connect because this was a man. The reason we got divorced is I couldn’t be me. I couldn’t I couldn’t express my need to connect with spirituality. He wasn’t having anything about it. So that was the sort of the breaking point for us. Well, he was just a whole life atheist, and he didn’t believe in anything. So that’s why I think I’m such a advocate for, you know, increasing our self awareness and and awakening our consciousness to all that we are because guess what? That’s the only freaking thing we take with us. Is our consciousness. And I’ve been witnessing that and communicating with that. And yes, we can affect those loved ones that seem to be stuck. Okay? For some reason, it’s like our energy is a soul in this human body has seniority. At some for for, I don’t know, the heirarchy, but it’s my understanding and from my experience.

Dr. Amirah Hall: So in doing the work for my ex-husband, Dave, I cleared the energy, then one day I was walking on my path where all the cardinals come to say hello to me. And this one day, all of a sudden, I felt Dave. And I’m like, wow. I wasn’t looking for it or expecting you know, and he just he had the attitude of, you know, your first love like, when you’re a puppy love and you’re so sweet on somebody and you’re kind of embarrassed or shy and that’s how he was. He was like a young soul that didn’t really know how this worked and that he was just beginning at his level of comprehension of what love was. And he was reflecting to me some of the things he did for me. Like, I didn’t think it was very funny or nice for a vacuum for Christmas. And he thought that was loving. Okay. And so back in those days, I was, you know, that was meant to be done. And, you know, so I was getting to laugh at some of these ridiculous things that I got spun up over, but he was showing me that he really, really did love me. And that was incredibly healing for me, spent all these years and a surprise. And it’s been it was two years after he passed that I was finally able to connect with him. I didn’t I didn’t work on it and intend on it, you know, and make it like I had to. But that’s what happens when we heal. It’s us that needs to heal, then the communication. They’re right there.

Victoria Volk: Oh, is that your tip? Is that people work on healing themselves? If —

Dr. Amirah Hall: Absolutely. —

Victoria Volk: so that they can connect?

Dr. Amirah Hall: Absolutely. We are we’re always like you and I are telepathically connected. And, you know, it’s just because they’ve left changed forms doesn’t mean they’re not communicating or they’re not able to communicate. It’s us. It’s the receiver. That’s been dumb down or doled out. And, you know, just a little the frequency, we have to raise our frequency to have that connection. It’s just like sometimes you can call somebody and add all the static on the line or it’s intermittent and you go, you know what? Let’s just hang up. You call again and boom, it’s good. Right? And that’s like that with communicating with spirit. So you don’t need a medium, but you need to get clear. And I find one of the very basic tools that I teach people because people don’t know how to be presence. Because if they’re stuck thinking about how their loved one died or some things they didn’t say, or they wish it could be different. They wish Johnny was with us at Christmas or it’s his birthday today, then you’re stuck in the past. Your energy is literally in that past experience that moment in time. And what that does overall is it reduces your frequency and you’re stuck in what I call depression. And so in the work I do is we learn to really accumulate, reaccumulate our own energies, our lives, and raise that so that we can be happier. So we are more inspired. So we are more motivated and fluid. And then, it’s like when opportunities open up, set new situations, you present yourself in ways that you couldn’t have expected. You know, my client that I was sharing when we cleared her energy and she was able to have that communication with her son, she started wearing shorts for the first time in thirty years. Right? And she would she said, I’m cutting up and I’m goofing off and I’m just she goes, my daughter doesn’t even know me like this. So parts of herself that she’d shut off, maybe when she decided when she became a mom. That’s the moment to come. Okay. Now I gotta be serious. I gotta grow up. And those aspects to our personality or what’s in our heart kinda get lost? Yeah. So it is work. It’s being a raising our awareness to being present. Having the appropriate tools, how can I do this? You know, if it’s I’m not a subscriber to talk therapy because in my own moments of grief, I just I got sick and tired of just talking about it. Like, I’m a bottom line girl. Give me some freaking way to get rid of it because I like this feeling to be caught in this loop.

Victoria Volk: Exactly. And so, like, even for what the work that I do with grievers, it’s action based. You’re always taking action. There’s steps. There’s it’s a process. Right. It’s evidence-based. Yes. I’m totally and it’s Transforms my transform my life and my grief too.

Dr. Amirah Hall: Yes. Yes. And, you know, like, we were talking. I mean, you can be sacked from your job, and that’s grief.

Victoria Volk: Mhmm.

Dr. Amirah Hall: You know, you can, yes, losing a loved one is is probably the ultimate, but losing a relationship, that’s a heavy grief. And

Victoria Volk: Loss of health.

Dr. Amirah Hall: Yes.

Victoria Volk: And all of it

Dr. Amirah Hall: I had all

Victoria Volk: of you. Yeah.

Dr. Amirah Hall: And I’m not alone. I know there’s millions of people doing the same shit that I did. And because we’ve not been taught, we’ve not been taught the nuances of our energy. How our thoughts are creating?

Victoria Volk: Can I ask you a question? Because something came up when I because in my in my own personal experience with my own energy. Right?

Dr. Amirah Hall: Uh-huh.

Dr. Amirah Hall: So I think, you know, as time, we can go through periods where, you know, like, for my for me personally, like, I’ve been on and off the health wagon for many years on and off on and off. What I have discovered just in the last month is nutrition and how food is fuel. And food is cheap. Right? Energy?

Dr. Amirah Hall: Yes.

Victoria Volk: Everything you eat is energy. The plants animals like it, this is energy. And if you are consistently and especially in grief or if you’re depressed, stress, can be a big one? Like, what are you reaching for? The sugary cake? or

Dr. Amirah Hall: of course.

Victoria Volk: Probably not the salad. Right? So so what she do you want? If you are ready or low vibe and you’re already down and out and you’re feeling in the dumps, that sugary cake is not gonna bring you up. Right? It’s not gonna bring up your tea. So when you are going through like that deep depressive period in your life, I imagine you are probably terribly under eating and not caring for wrongly eating, I actually heard something not that long ago about vegetarians. About how vegetarians can actually come off as very angry people, because they don’t they don’t eat protein. But what they don’t realize is that they’re still eating they’re still eating living things. Right? So it’s like they don’t wanna eat meat. Like, because it’s because it’s animal.

Victoria Volk: But a plant is a living thing too. Right?

Dr. Amirah Hall: I know. They have no problem killing that.

Victoria Volk: Right. So let’s bring it with poison. Yes.

Dr. Amirah Hall: Well, here’s you know, we could that’s a whole another podcast because back in those days in the nineties, and when I’ve discovered with chronic fatigue, I started colon cleansing. I started doing detoxes. Like I said before, one year before I went to Egypt, I started doing thirty day detoxes twice a year. And I was into juicing, and I was into enemas, and a coffee enemas, and you name it. Well, at one point, I was vegan then I went to a mix. Right? So I’ve seen the journey across the board. Now, because things were so compromised as a young girl with my emotions and eating all the carbs growing up and sandwiches every day to go to school. And I believe while my immune system is still compromised. So now we understand about leaky gut. We understand, hey, I’ve been in the process of healing. It’s a big it’s a long journey. And I’ve recently switched the carnivore, which I have to say, I don’t tell many people and I don’t admit but I am absolutely loving it and I’m shocked at my own self because there was one time, I would say to you, if you’re eating animal, you’re, you know, going to the hell or the you know. But I as a vegetarian, complete vegetarian for a number of years, I got very sick. I got anemic. Right? And so all of these you know, broad range and scope swings that I’ve done to do desperate to heal myself. I think the biggest most important thing I’ve done is my energy. And when we have energy that’s stuck, that will make us crave carbs because today, even though I’m now carnivore in like six or nine months, I know people that have been a carnivore for fourteen years. And the thing of it is is their that cow is eating all the nutrients and pre-digesting it is going into the meat. So that’s the argument. So my health has improved. Inflammation has been reduced and cravings have pretty much stopped. Yeah. So it’s a shock to me and I’m delighted. However, I’m as I said, I’m working on it and I’m actually gaining weight. Now is it because my body still you know, a lot of things, adrenals, etcetera. But one thing I notice is I when I’m teaching a class or working with clients, two days before I’m like, shit. And I find myself driving to the store and getting that butter pecan ice cream. I’m like, what the I don’t I don’t need this. What is it’s somebody’s energy, literally, plugging into me. I get on the call, I said, you know, like, buttered pecan ice cream by any chance, do you? That’s my favorite. No. Unknowingly, I’ve been affected by this person’s energy that was seeking me and looking for their answers or their healing. And so it does affect us, especially ultra-sensitive people. So if all of a sudden, like the other night, I was craving chocolate, That’s not normally on my list, but I’m like, okay, somebody’s energies permeated my space. We can’t completely stop energy. You can’t stop energy from moving. It’s just the nature of it. So we have to learn tools. We have to learn how to be grounded, how to protect, not protect because that’s a sense that you can actually control energy. You can’t, you can manage it. So learning all of that is key.

Victoria Volk: It can only be transformed, moved, or transformed.

Dr. Amirah Hall: Yes. Yes. And so whether it’s grief, whether it’s, you know, gaining around your waistline, whether it’s a new job, whether it’s a relationship, we’re creating all of that with our energy, with our thoughts, with our consciousness. And so we start, we gotta start somewhere. Right? So let’s start with being aware. Grounding, being present.

Victoria Volk: Gosh. We could talk so much. I mean,

Dr. Amirah Hall: I know I know it’s so exciting because I’m

Victoria Volk: so glad you like, that that the conversation went with the with the carnivore and because I beat I’m eating more protein than I had in years. I — Right. — I spent years trashing my metabolism.

Dr. Amirah Hall: Right.

Victoria Volk: But and it’s a vicious cycle, you know, and then you have the cortisol and the middle section where they can

Dr. Amirah Hall: And you believe all the doctors. Well, listen, I’m there is a lot of cardiologists now and other mainstream doctors that are starting to go this route. So I’m just open. I’m just open to exploring. And I didn’t tell anybody for the longest time because I’m my own labrat. Like, I’m gonna try it. And then if it works for me, then I’ll share it with other clients. But, hey, I’m shocked. And I’m just like,

Victoria Volk: But I think one of the key things you said was when the pendulum swings so far one way, you know, where you’re just a vegetarian and that’s all you’re doing. Any one way isn’t balanced.

Dr. Amirah Hall: Well, and the thing of it is I’ve met so many vegetarians. They’re completely ungrounded. They don’t. They can’t get their life together. They struggle. In in most cases, not all. But they struggle in some ways and that is being present or you can just see the, like, the life force energy isn’t strong or bright, usually with them. Oh, again, I’m not talking about the, you know, the monk or the guru from India. I’m talking about Western and live in this lifestyle. So Yeah.

Victoria Volk: I definitely wanna have you back because there’s so much more I want to talk about with you if that’s okay?

Dr. Amirah Hall: Oh, I’d love that. Thank you

Victoria Volk: too. Okay. Yeah. And I do wanna give you an opportunity to share what you have coming up or where people can find you or reach out to you if they wanna learn more about you?

Dr. Amirah Hall: Great. Yes. I’m hosting a twenty-one-speaker series with incredibly brilliant and amazing experts. And so you can go to intuitivesuperpowerssummit.com Intuitive superpowers with an s summit dot com. And, yeah, go to my website. I’ve got a free gift It’s called stress buster. And you go to my website, amirahhall.com forward slash stress buster dot com.

Victoria Volk: And I’ll get those links in the show notes as well.

Dr. Amirah Hall: Yeah. The yeah. So stress buster, and that’s agood energy shower, and you can start clearing your energy and moving in the direction of coming into alignment and connecting with your loved one.

Victoria Volk: And where can people find you just your website? Are there social media?

Dr. Amirah Hall: Yes. Amira, A M I R A H H A L L. COM. You can read all about me there.

Victoria Volk: Sounds wonderful. Thank you so much for this great conversation.

Dr. Amirah Hall: I just want to invite people if something triggered something within you reach out to me on my website. There’s a link and you can book a twenty-minute consultation. And we’ll just talk about maybe what your next step is or where you feel that maybe you need help. Okay?

Victoria Volk: Sounds great.

Dr. Amirah Hall: Thank you so much. It’s been such an honor. Thank you for opening your heart and doing the work you’re doing. It’s truly amazing and I’m I feel very blessed to be connected with you.

Victoria Volk: Same. And remember, when you unleash your heart, you unleash your life. Much love.

 

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